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No photos, please: Nauru ‘unlike anything ever seen in Australia’

Amnesty International inspectors became the first independent assessors to visit the Nauru immigration camp this week, describing the conditions in vivid details for Crikey.

Nauru might be an enormous topic politically, but in reality the entire camp on the remote island is just 100 metres by 150 metres.

That’s where 387 asylum seekers — all men — currently spend nearly 24 hours a day. Most of the area is taken up by rows of green army tents packed with stretcher beds. The smaller tents fit five or six beds, while the larger tents have 16 or 17 beds crammed in. There’s barely any room to walk between the stretchers inside the tents and detainees have zero privacy.

Asylum seekers hang up their towels and clothes to dry by their beds, but with temperatures sitting around 40 degrees — if not 50 inside the tents — and humidity at 80%, it’s rare that items ever dry completely. Recently each tent received two fans, which helps. Wet bedding and clothes has caused several of the asylum seekers to develop rashes, for which medical services are regularly dolling out antiseptic cream.

Alex Pagliaro, refugee campaign co-ordinator for Amnesty International Australia, just spent several days visiting the detention centre in Nauru with her colleague Graham Thom, and has described these conditions to Crikey. The pair were the first independent assessors to be allowed access to the camp and have released a review on the conditions in Nauru this morning.

There is little shade and no trees in the centre, apart from an area known as the “recreation area”, a concrete slab with a shade cloth on top. Heat in the compound is exacerbated by the fact that the only surface is grey gravel, which makes any meaningful recreation — like playing sport — difficult.

Along one section of the camp, where Nauru’s tropical jungle meets the asylum seekers, trees and vines hang over providing shade. Only 20 to 30 people can huddle under there, but it’s significantly cooler than the rest of the camp and a popular spot.

Detainees keep in touch with the outside world via Facebook. One of the asylum seekers has set up a Facebook page to chronicle how the detainees are going and he has been given extra internet time in order to maintain that page on behalf of the rest of the men. Six different languages are spoken in the camp.

Occasional excursions are organised, but there’s not much to do in Nauru. Outings usually consist of bussing the men to a beach or shady spot and leaving them there with guards for an hour or two. There are no movie theatres, shopping centres or parks to visit.

Conditions in the camp are unlike anything I’ve ever seen in Australian detention centres,” Pagliaro told Crikey. “They are far, far harsher. It is such a shame that we weren’t allowed to take photos because they would have been stark.”

Amnesty says the Department of Immigration had given permission for photographs to be taken and the head of security in Nauru had approved photographs, before DIAC revoked the use of cameras just before Pagliaro and Thom were to enter the camp. A spokesperson for DIAC told Crikey: “No one was given permission to take photos inside an immigration detention facility. Claims they had received prior permission from DIAC were completely false.”

Amnesty denies this and says permission had been discussed and agreed upon when Pagliaro and Thom arrived on Nauru, before the pair were informed on Wednesday morning that permission had been withdrawn.

But although the housing conditions are worse than Australian centres and there’s been suicide attempts (including a man who attempted to hang himself from a tent pole this week). “I didn’t get that sense of just overwhelming hopelessness that you do get in Christmas and Curtin island, when people have been locked up for years and are like walking zombies,” said Pagliaro.

She also notes this is partly because detainees have only been there for two months and that people were getting more desperate, describing it as a “pressure cooker situation”.

48
  • 1
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    Its not meant to be a holiday camp Amber

  • 2
    zut alors
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 3:09 pm | Permalink

    Don’t you just love it when politicians do their annual ‘sleep out’ in the elements for one night every winter, allegedly experiencing what conditions are like for the homeless? Such an ideal opportunity for publicity shots for the self-satisfied to circulate in their electorates.

    But I’d prefer to see them spend a couple days on Nauru in those steamy tents with the only exercise being their thumbs to twiddle. A taste of reality can’t hurt.

  • 3
    GeeWizz
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 3:31 pm | Permalink

    And here I was expecting Amnesty to say how great Nauru facilities are /sarcasm

    I think the real crime here is that months after Nauru is reopened this incompetent Labor Government have only sent 387 illegals there…. thats less people than were on the Tampa(450) who Howard sent directly to Nauru… do not pass Christmas Island, do not collect your $200 Dole chequre.

    Once the Coalition shuts down the Labor People Smuggling business like they did in 2001, they’ll be able to close all these detention centres again. How many people in detention when Rudd took over, 4 people total wasn’t it?

  • 4
    Jorani Long
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 3:57 pm | Permalink

    My parents escaped the Khmer Rouge to Indonesia and lived in a refugee camp with many other Cambodians and Vietnamese. The condition was horribly poor by Australian standard but they did have a little economy, entertainments and education. Even if the government sends all of the asylum seekers to Nauru, they will still keep coming as there is more of a certain chance to be settled in Australia than waiting overseas with uncertain future.

    It looks like the government is not doing anything to provide better conditions for refugees waiting overseas, and nothing to to give them hope and certainty that they will be resettled faster if they stay and wait which will be better than risking their lives coming to Australia on rickety boats. The hope and benefits at the end far outweigh waiting in transit countries, the light at the end of the tunnel for boat people is more seductive than moths to the flame.

    This site changed a lot since my last visit.

  • 5
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 4:17 pm | Permalink

    ^ Actual experience beats opinion anyday eh GeeWizz? ^

  • 6
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 5:04 pm | Permalink

    Iain it is a deliberately contrived torture chamber that will cost taxpayers over $1.6 billion to achieve precisely nothing except broken lives.

    What sort of callous coward are you.

  • 7
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 5:06 pm | Permalink

    There is no people smuggling business, people smuggling is the forced movement of human beings across borders for exploitation and against their wills.

    REfugees most definitely want to move so it is not possible to smuggle them anywhere.

  • 8
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 5:21 pm | Permalink

    From the dictionary on my Mac : “Smuggling is the clandestine transportation of goods or persons, such as out of a building, into a prison, or across an international border, in violation of applicable laws or other regulations.” Smuggling does not mean forced.

  • 9
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 5:55 pm | Permalink

    Human smuggling does, to be human smuggling it requires coercion and ongoing exploitation.

    And there is nothing covert about it, as our own courts have said for over a decade now.

    As it is a legal right to come here by sea where is the smuggling?

  • 10
    Matt Steadman
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:03 pm | Permalink

    Does anyone know the name of the Facebook page referred to in the article? I can’t seem to find it after a couple of basic searches

  • 11
    Christopher Nagle
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:03 pm | Permalink

    Well, I am hoping that the discomforts and uncertainties of living in tents on Nauru is getting through to the commercial asylum pipeline overseas. I do not have the slightest sympathy. See my article ‘Commercial Asylum Seekers’ for why, at http://www.writing.com/main/view_item/item_id/1904635-Commercial-Asylum-Seekers

  • 12
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:19 pm | Permalink

    http://www.facebook.com/ASYLUMSEEKERSINNAURU, try this.

  • 13
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:23 pm | Permalink

    http://www.facebook.com/ASYLUMSEEKERSINNAURU, I put up a link but it is in moderation, I don’t know whether this will work but anyway.

  • 14
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:29 pm | Permalink

    Third time, mods are killing the link, add what what you need to but the basics are ASYLUMSEEKERSINNAURU, maybe + facebook etc. if this fails…..

  • 15
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:36 pm | Permalink

    https://www.facebook.com/pages/IrSrIrqAfgh-in-nauru-2012-%D9%85%D9%87%D8%A7%D8%AC%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86-%D8%A7%D8%B3%D8%AA%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%84%DB%8C%D8%A7-%D8%AF%D8%B1-%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%88/229791230480956
    or

    http://naururefugees.wordpress.com/

    And for god’s sake Christopher Nagle, the whole commercial asylum seeker story is an invention by Bowen to justify his cruelty.

    There is no such thing as a commercial asylum seeker.

    There is a specific definition - a person seeking international protection under the refugee convention.

    Will you dry up.

  • 16
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:40 pm | Permalink

    So Chris, do you have a skerrick of evidence to back your ridiculous claims?

    Nope, thought not.

    Everything you claim has been debunked a decade ago, it was never true and it is not true now.

    REfugees for resettlement are not entitled to that resettlement, asylum seekers who want protection are the only people covered by the refugee convention.

  • 17
    floorer
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:46 pm | Permalink

    Sorry got slack, put http://. face book. com/ before A etc. Gaps put in by me for obvious reasons.

  • 18
    fred
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 6:47 pm | Permalink

    It’s an Immigration Concentration Camp.
    It’s a Holding Centre not a Processing Centre.

    Nauru’s Constitution is compromised by the arbitrary imprisonment of people not charged with a crime.

    Deprivation of a person’s liberty, in the absence os charges, is an abuse of human rights.

    Laid back Nauruans who love their island home will find their lives and their reputation contaminated and destroyed by this toxic ommercial contract at the expense of human misery.

    What’s your price, Mr President, for granting all of them Nauruan citizenship and a passport, with a visa to NZ or somewhere safe where human rights are respected? .

  • 19
    Stevo the Working Twistie
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 7:00 pm | Permalink

    Well said @fred. Also, laid back Australians who love their island home will find their lives and their reputation contaminated and destroyed by this. If I hear these poor bastards describes as “illegals” one more time I think my head will explode. Fascist bastardry, pure and simple. Sleep well Australia.

  • 20
    GeeWizz
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 7:09 pm | Permalink

    Fred I’m sure they care about their reputation being stuck out in the middle of nowhere and barely making ends meet.

    Even the lefties can’t be this stupid…

  • 21
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 8:47 pm | Permalink

    They want a reputation so spiv bankers will go there.

  • 22
    Andybob
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 10:57 pm | Permalink

    We promised to protect refugees and not punish them for arriving irregularly. We lied and we cannot be trusted.

  • 23
    Tom Makin
    Posted Friday, 23 November 2012 at 11:00 pm | Permalink

    huh? $200? same as austudy? why not basics card? these days most asylum seekers only pay a few hundreds dollars up front then pay the rest of the $7000 after the get to Oz.

    how will the gov know that they won’t be working illegally?

    it’s not like they come to Oz for the dole anyway, refugees or not. the illegal immigrants in the US come for work and they get jack from the gov

  • 24
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    The thing is Bowen was so proud and pleased that he could show the brutality of this around the world and people would say they would rather stay home and die. Our moron pollies never understand that refugees are humans with rights and will fight back against our mad oppression.

  • 25
    GeeWizz
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 6:09 pm | Permalink

    Can we get some descriptions of a real U.N Refugee camp in say.. Africa to compare Nauru to?

    Whats the conditions like there? Do they have high speed internet you reckon?

  • 26
    GeeWizz
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 7:37 pm | Permalink

    The coalition will be pushing to reintroduce TPV’s

    The government will need to support this measure otherwise they will come off as the limp-wristed, gutless wonders that they are.

    Are Labor going to use their line that the Coalition is too tough on illegals when they the trickle of boats have now turned into a flood under their watch?

    TPV’s must be reintroduced otherwise Labor has once again shown itself to be weak or border security.

  • 27
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 8:58 pm | Permalink

    Geewiz, is Africa the best we can aspire to. The Africans don’t deliberately make refugee camps horrendous, we have.

  • 28
    Achmed
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 11:39 pm | Permalink

    No this can’t be right. It can’t be as bad as it is being made to sound. Abbott told the public all it needed was a coat of paint to return it to its former glory under Howard.

  • 29
    Achmed
    Posted Saturday, 24 November 2012 at 11:55 pm | Permalink

    Gee Wizz - you dont think the policy of “remain in detention until your time would have come if you went in the queue” isn’t tough enough? Or the Bridging Visas that have tougher conditions than the lip wristed TPV is tough enough?
    It is not lost on the thinking public that Abbott and his 27% screamed for Nauru to open, now thats not working its because Labor haven’t introduced TPV’s…where to when it is proven they are a failure? What rant will Abbott and the 27% resort to next?

  • 30
    Patriot
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 1:55 am | Permalink

    The arrangement under which we accommodate these illegals can’t even properly be called detention. They are free to return home any time they wish. They remain in the Nauru facility by choice so I’ve no sympathy for them whatsoever.

    I only wish they’d let Amnesty take some photos of the rashes to put in the travel brochure.

  • 31
    GeeWizz
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 2:03 am | Permalink

    Achmed… Dillard is failing to send illegals to Nauru thats why the policy is failing.

    Nauru has been open for 2 months now yet only 330 illegals sent? This has to be a bad joke.

    Using Bowens own weasel words your chance of “running the risk of being sent to Nauru” seems about as likely as winning the lotto. Labor are gutless.

  • 32
    Achmed
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 9:18 am | Permalink

    Its taking a long time to put that coat of paint on the buildings. The truth is Abbott lied about the condition of the buidlings and has created an expection, particularly among his 27% that there was nothing to do except pack ‘em up and send ‘em

  • 33
    barnett malcolm
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 11:22 am | Permalink

    Here’s the deal!….As a financialy challenged member of Australian society, I haven’t had any sort of a holiday in 30 years. If somebody would like to supply me with some fishing gear, a surfboard, a tent and a hammock and a plane fair to get there I would love to go to Nauru or any other tropical island for a couple of months. The idea that these illegal, economic migrants are living in hell is another example of the shamefull emotional blackmail perpetrated on the uninformed Australian public. If these illegal migrants want to claim to live in hell, they should go and wait their turn in one of the worlds desperate refugee camps. Also, the claim that their circumstance is worse than living in prison….Also the idea that the UN has chosen to decieve and emotionaly blackmail Australia and the Australian people is shamefull…..My question to the UN is what do Sweden, Switzland, and many other European country’s also Japan, India, China or Hawaii or Peru, etc. or for that matter hundreds of other country’s around the world say to you when accused of not accepting their international responsibility’s. These ongoing deceptions borders on lies. Australia already takes “”MORE REFUGEES”” per capita than any other country in the world.

  • 34
    barnett malcolm
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 11:45 am | Permalink

    Speaking of people smugglers…Australians should be very angry and outraged by the actions of the ‘Indonesian’ government. It’s the Indonesian’ government that accepts and allows these so-called refugees access, with their $20,000, into ‘Indonesia’. After paying the required bribes and payments to ‘Indonesian’ customs and related government officials to get into their country in the first place and then paying off ‘Indonesian’ people smugglers and ‘Indonesian’ fishermen to set sale from ‘Indonesian’ fishing ports in ‘Indonesian’ fishing boats with the ‘Indonesian’ governments permission and encouragement, after relieving these ‘refugees’ of all their cash, with the obvious intention of simply handballing the entire, ‘no longer profitable’ problem onto Australia. Then being determined to not take any responsibility at all for aiding and abetting the people smuggling trade in the first place….What gutless cowards the Australian government are for not confronting and challenging the ‘Indonesian’ government for their direct involvement in this trade…What mugs ‘Indonesians’ must think Australians are….Pissed off ???. You bet I am!

  • 35
    zac48
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 1:03 pm | Permalink

    A further thought in addition to the one above…The ”entire world”, not just people smugglers in Indonesia, are watching the Labor Party’s refugee policy collapse. There are hundreds of millions of people who will/would attempt to get to this country anyway they can. As far as these illegal economic migrants are concerned it’s better than winning tattslotto. Not only getting into Australia without any real drama, but to be succored at the breast of their own national compatriots in their own national ghetto suburb and to get payed for it as well with all sorts of advantages Australians don’t even get. No wonder millions of people would come to the ‘Great Eldorado’ down south if they could only get here. As the populations of these country’s continue to uncontrollably explode it will become apparent that what we see today is only the beginning of an overwhelming tide of humanity.

  • 36
    Tom Makin
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 2:22 pm | Permalink

    that’s a myth dude. TPV was introduced years before Nauru was open and it did not reduce the number of boats, more boats arrived in fact due to the push factor.

    but some kind of ‘disincentive’ is necessary which is only half a the equation tho (and it has some effect on discouraging Sri Lankan economic migrants), the other half is creating ‘incentives’ for people to apply, stay and wait in other countries. they can’t not have any disincentive like the greens’ policy which actually even gives a lot of incentives for people to get on boats to come to Oz in a hurry; why wouldn’t people come when they can work before they are determined to be real refugee or not and earn much better money than at home? why would they wait overseas for years when they will be given the chance to start quickly by the greens once they’ve reached Oz?

  • 37
    Apollo
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 3:50 pm | Permalink

    $20,000? Whoopee doo, I know plenty of Germans who have paid 20K for people to do a spousal visa for them to stay in Australia or New Zealand. What shock and horrors, we are being invaded by foreigners!!

  • 38
    Patriot
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 7:13 pm | Permalink

    I left a comment on these illegals’ WordPress site challenging their claim that they are being held in detention. Detention is a gross mischaracterisation of a situation where they are provided with free accommodation and have the freedom to return to their country of origin at any time. It is also offensive to me as someone who is paying for their accommodation.

    My comment has been awaiting moderation for nearly an entire day. I’m starting to suspect that they’re a bunch of puѕѕies. When they start burning their tents like a bunch of savages we can call it a puѕѕy riot.

  • 39
    Tom Makin
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 9:08 pm | Permalink

    geez patriot, you sound like someone i met in Alaska.

    here’s the dilemma for the gov. they can’t allow them to work and provide an incentive for a much higher number to come, who would not want to earn 130 times or more than they earn back home? but it is unproductive if they are not allowed to work, and the gov also have to pay them $200 something per week to support them which will only end up giving incentive for many more to come, because they can use the money to pay back the rest of the amount that they owe the traffickers and they most likely will work cash in hand also.

    maybe someone bright will figure out a solution one day, probably by the time world peace is achieved and there is no border.

  • 40
    zac48
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 11:15 pm | Permalink

    Why doesn’t the Australian government do a deal($$$)or come to some arrangement with Malaysia? or the first place of asylum before Malaysia that these refugees? pass through. As soon as they’re picked up they’re immediately flown back to this country of asylum, no questions asked, no explanations given. They don’t even get to spend the weekend on Australian territory let alone start legal proceedings against this country. Indonesia should be happy with such a deal, they’ll still be able to relieve them of their $20,000 in cash as they pass through Indonesia heading for Australia. As soon as these illegals work out they will ‘immediately’ get flown straight back to the last country of asylum they passed through before Indonesia less their $20,000 the message will sink in…. Enough feelgood bullsh*t Gillard, this isn’t a game.

  • 41
    Apollo
    Posted Sunday, 25 November 2012 at 11:42 pm | Permalink

    They are not making sense. Why don’t they allow asylum seekers to work and earn a maximum of $200 per week to look after themselves instead of the government paying them?

    zac48, the Coalition is not interested in allowing this government to succeed in executing any deal with Malaysia and the Greens will oppose it also. The other poor countries also already have to house so many asylum seekers there, it is not in there interest to take more in to solve problem for Australia, they would be willing for the kind of payment and swap deal that the government did with Malaysia but the Coalition is not going to support new legislation to allow that to happen.

    You are making a big deal out of this which will help to perpetuate the problem further, even if the Indonesians don’t get into the people smuggling actions, the right-wing Australians will to bring the Labor government down; and then you have the Nauruans who want the problem to continue so they can profit from it.

  • 42
    Apollo
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 7:21 am | Permalink

    They possibly can reduce illegal works by making asylum seekers attending compulsory classes or seminars 3 times a day held at around 4 hours apart, at 2 different campuses located half an hour away by travel time.

    It’ll be best for asylum seekers to look for jobs and get accepted for 2 days of work per week first before they are moved out into the community so they can work and pay their way. It’s very strange not to allow them to work and pay them the dole instead considering the backlash from both the right-wingers and the lefties. I just don’t understand what this government does, and what all the elected politicians do with their day.

  • 43
    zac48
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 11:32 am | Permalink

    Apollo, I think it fairly obvious that any circumstance or situation that is created around/for these, until proven different, illegal immigrants will simply encourage even more attempts to enter this country. For all intents and purposes, to allow them to simply ‘move into’ the Australian community and to pay them any amount of money infers their ultimate acceptance and will simply encourage even more attempts. $200 is a huge amount of money to these people compared to what they might earn in their own country, particularly since they don’t come into Australian society to exist on their own but expect the help of already existing friends, family or other ‘nationals’ support that would be offered to them. The idea that these people wouldn’t be given, or find ‘cash in hand’ work, just like so many of their countrymen and Australians in general is just naive and is a huge incentive to them. Any attempt to ‘compel’ or otherwise any participation in the Australian community sends the message that Australia will eventually acquiesce to their ‘demands’. Even being moved into refugee camps on the Australian mainland infers the same ultimate acceptance after jumping through the appropriate hoops. An eventual ‘lay down mazaire’. These ‘economic country shoppers’ shouldn’t even be given the magnetic opportunity to be housed on islands like Nauru, particularly after travelling through Indonesia with the Indonesian governments imprimatur after contributing $20,000 dollars to various parts of the Indonesian society. A win win for Indonesia. If Indonesia won’t accept their responsibilities after making a sizable amount of money from the exploitation of these people, they should be immediately flown back to the prior country of asylum before Indonesia. If that means country’s even prior to Malaysia, so be it….. I suggest the same invalid and spurious demands made by the UN on Australia be made on country’s like our heroes Denmark or Sweden. These countries are continually thrown up at Australians as being ‘ideal’ societies which Australia should be encouraged to emulate.

  • 44
    Apollo
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 11:55 am | Permalink

    zac48

    I don’t quite grasp your point and find your writing confusing.

    Anyway, don’t conflate refugees with economic migrants. We have both types coming by boat, refugees have the right to come. What people need is proper policy to deter them from risking their lives and provide them alternative way to come without risk.

    $200 is a lot back in their country, but in Australia $200 barely cover rent, food, utility and travel. If it makes people feel more secure then make all their wage paid directly into a government account to cover rent education and medical levy. The asylum seekers can get $10 cash per week and $50 grocery card and a travel card or cash allowance for travel.

    I’ve already said the LNP is not interested in allowing any legislation that might solve this problem and the Greens will object to it also, so you can forget Indonesia or any other country on your list.

  • 45
    zac48
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    Apollo. Don’t obfuscate or ‘deliberately’ confuse the discussion. ‘Refugees’ are not recognised as being legitimate ‘refugees’ until appropriate investigations and enquiries have been made to substantiate their claim. A catch 22 perhaps, but none the less a fact. No doubt this is the very reason all paperwork is destroyed before contact with Australian authorities, thereby making it as difficult as possible for Australia to prove they are ‘not refugees’. Also, there is not anyone who lives anywhere in the Middle East who could not be justified in declaring their life is at risk and therefore qualify for refugee status. That is the very nature of living anywhere in that part of the world. Even Israelis could legitimately claim their lives are at risk and claim refugee status but there aren’t boat loads of them coming to Australia claiming asylum, which might suggest that these so-called refugees are nothing more than economic migrants and country shoppers bypassing other safe havens to reach Australia and are illegal as a result. In regard to your comment about $200 being an insignificant amount of money in Australia, you obviously don’t comprehend that these people aren’t in Australia and theoretical have no understanding as to what $200 might be worth in Australia and can’t make any comparison at all between the Australian economy and it’s internal values compared to their own countries economy, that is of course unless these people have already been coached by friends, relatives or others as to what to expect when they arrive in this country. As I said $200 is a huge amount of money in their own country, if they could get a job, and is of itself a huge attraction to come to this country. Also, regardless of the amount of money and other advantages that might be given to them by the Australian taxpayer almost every single one of these people have established communities of family, friends or others of the same nationality into which they are immediately welcomed and assimilate, hence they are ‘not’ on their own in a strange country but have considerable, already established support systems at their disposal and as a result of these already established support systems have no difficulty in finding part-time or full-time ‘cash’ paying work to add to their already received $200. In regard to your comment about Indonesia, it is they who bare as much responsibility for this situation as anybody else. ‘Every cent’ these thousands of people bring with them goes straight into the Indonesian economy and $20,000 is a huge amount of money in a third world country like Indonesia. The problem is the Australian government are so cowardly and gutless they aren’t prepared to challenge Indonesia on this subject….. Any further comments welcomed Apollo.

  • 46
    zac48
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 3:33 pm | Permalink

    PS Apollo. It’s the outrageous lies, deceptions and manipulations of the truth and the obvious attempt by these people to treat Australians like fools that ‘most’ people resent. Australia, compared to any other country in the world, already willingly accepts more than a ‘fair’ number of ‘real’ refugees into this country but are absolutely justified in not accepting deceivers, lier’s, manipulators, conmen and shameless queue jumpers who are here to use and take advantage of this country. It would seem that the attitude of these so-called refugees is quite normal, reasonable and culturally acceptable in their own countries, but it isn’t acceptable here in Australia. Whatever they’ve been told, they are not socially or culturally superior and will never succeed in the intimidation, manipulation, deception or emotional blackmail of the Australian people.

  • 47
    Apollo
    Posted Monday, 26 November 2012 at 4:54 pm | Permalink

    zac48

    You are the one who is doing the obfuscation.

    Not all boat arrivals don’t have paperworks. There are mixed number of economic migrants and refugees coming by boat. Even if only 1% of them are genuine refugees, that 1% have the right to come by law. And the important point is how we offer them the chance for better alternative way to come and deter them having to risk their lives on boat, and such deterrence will include deterring economic migrants as well.

    The reason they are still considered refugees after passing through Indonesia is because Indonesia don’t offer them re-settlements, refugees are not obliged to stay in limbo and Indonesia is not obliged to hold them if they want to leave, refugees also have the right to refuse resettlement offer by a country through the UN and apply for another country.

    The contentious issue is that once they’ve reach Australia, they don’t belong to the category of fleeing immediate danger. So Australia probably does not have a strong obligation to provide the same kind of immediate help and rights offered under the refugee law Australia signed up for.

    That’s why I have advocated in the past that while awaiting assessment, they are yet determined to be refugee so they should not be allowed to earn income, but either do voluntary work, or earn only sufficient to survive. Your’re saying they don’t know how expensive it is to live in Australia then they would not know how much wage they will earn either, but you are being disingenuous since you mentioned that these look after their relations back home and attract more of them to come so they would have a pretty good idea when they arrive.

    As for saying everyone who lives in the Middle East live in danger expose how ignorant your comment is. Do you think Qatari live in danger? What kind of systematic political or religious persecution that the Israeli government inflict on their own citizen, or a large group inflict on the minority group which the government is unable to protect its citizen within its border? See you are the one who don’t understand refugee law, and trying to obfuscate by going all over the place. There’s a war in Syria, 40,000 people died, hundred thousand of them flee, but none of the Middle Easterners are refugees to you, from your comment they are economic migrants.

    That’s enough, I don’t like to keep on commenting on the same thread nor do I have the time for someone like you. If I’m not mistaken you are Suzanne Blake still campaigning. Have a nice life, open up your heart a little and let some light in to cleanse away some of the toxic bile.

  • 48
    Lloyd Ganzerla
    Posted Tuesday, 18 December 2012 at 10:03 pm | Permalink

    You bleeding Hearts pay for them yourselves,That will cut back the intake because If you cant pay for them, ship them back. stop spending my and other australians tax money with our good notions, Lets spend money wasted on them on our medical system, Dental, NDIS, Homeless.
    A change of Government is needed To get rid of them all and discourage them.Also cut back on intake until australias Budget is clean again.

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