tip off

Substituting treaties for hard thinking on asylum seekers

It was, yes, a day of extraordinary drama in the House of Representatives.

Normal business was suspended. MPs openly wept. Nearly all speakers were heard in funereal silence. MPs congregated in strange clusters, disengaged, and reformed into others equally exotic, like free-floating cells trying to combine into a viable form. The Greens’ Sarah Hanson-Young sat in the distinguished visitors’ gallery behind the Coalition, joined at various stages by admixtures of colleague Adam Bandt, Andrew Wilkie, Mal Washer and Julie Bishop.

Warren Entsch hovered uncertainly just out of earshot of conversations. Mal Washer seemed to be unable to move without Julie Bishop either accompanying him or watching him intently. Joel Fitzgibbon at times took up a spot on the frontbench (where, of course, he feels he rightly belongs) to count off numbers with Anthony Albanese. Off-stage, equally animated talks were occurring.

Parliament had been shamed into this frantic activity by news of yet another boat sinking. The shame, however, didn’t extend to actual agreement. That viable form was never achieved. The government secured a notable win in engineering Rob Oakeshott’s bill through the house, with support from Andrew Wilkie once a sunset clause was added. But defeat of the bill in the Senate awaits at the hands of the Greens and the Coalition. The house and Senate will rise, MPs and senators will return home, the boats will continue to sink.

MPs can cry at the dispatch box all they like. Everyone’s emotional on this issue — voters, journalists, politicians. But only the latter are the ones who get the chance to do something about it, unlike the rest of us. And the Coalition and the Greens have elected not to do anything about it.

Let us carefully note the reasons why the bill will fail. Despite the government agreeing to adopt the useless measure of Nauru, which as a mere footnote will cost the best part of a billion dollars, and agreeing to consider temporary protection visas, the Coalition objects because Malaysia is not a signatory to the UN Refugee Convention. It had no such concerns when in government, when Nauru hadn’t signed the UN Convention. And its concerns aren’t genuine now, because Indonesia, to where the Coalition would return refugees on boats that remain seaworthy, isn’t a signatory either.

It’s a tissue-thin justification for opposition, this Damascene conversion to human rights by the Coalition. And to see Phillip Ruddock and Kevin Andrews, men whose records as ministers included savage assaults on basic civil rights, stand up to lecture the chamber was to feel more than a little sick.

And the Greens also maintain that the Malaysia deal is inconsistent with our UN Treaty obligations, that Australia’s priority should be to meet its treaty obligations, increase its humanitarian intake and that we should focus on a “real” regional solution, the nature of which isn’t exactly clear. Unlike the Coalition, the Greens aren’t latecomers to the idea of the importance of the UN Refugee Convention. But bear in mind the Greens’ membership is intensely hostile to anything other than onshore processing, meaning any decision to not oppose the bill would cause severe ructions within the party.

The elevation of our treaty obligations over any policy that might reduce the chances of people dying is legally correct, of course. It’s also morally blind, elevating adherence to the terms of a decades-old document over the possibility of saving lives. It substitutes sticking to a treaty for making hard decisions about what the least worst ways are of keeping people alive. What’s worse, getting caned in Malaysia, or drowning between Indonesia and Christmas Island? What’s worse, a child who has been put on a boat unaccompanied by her parents being sent to Malaysia or a child drowning? Don’t like the questions or the answers? That’s what we’re stuck with.

These are hard choices. Countries around the world grapple with the problem of stopping people from risking their lives fleeing to other countries either out of fear of persecution or for economic reasons. Thousands of people die every year in such circumstances. Obsessing over UN treaties or focusing on Malaysia’s human rights record is a fig leaf for an unwillingness to think rigorously about how to save lives.

At least we now have agreement about the need to increase our humanitarian intake, from all sides, although Tony Abbott seems to think the idea of taking an extra 5000 refugees a year would pose some complex dilemma that needs a special committee to resolve. But an increase in our intake was part and parcel of Chris Bowen’s Malaysian solution, as was increased assistance to the UNHCR. The government has already reached that policy position without needing additional drownings to motivate it. Australia can and should do more to resettle refugees — even if only on the self-interested basis that it will reduce the pressure that drives people to try to reach here by boats.

When the politicians return home today and tomorrow, with the problem unresolved, they’ll all be reflecting on exactly what they’ve done. And when the next boat sinks, those who have blocked an attempt to solve the problem should think about their own culpability.

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  • 1
    The Pav
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 1:32 pm | Permalink

    The poisoning of the debate by Howard will be his lkasting legacy to Australia.

    Remember after Vietnam how the issue was handled.

    Compare the two and the difference is sickening.

    Abbott has /had a chance to show some quality.

    Yet again he has failed the test and is siezing on the issue for political advantage and failing any test as a decent hman being.

    The stench of his actions is unbearable

  • 2
    paddy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 1:52 pm | Permalink

    I suppose it’s really not possible, for the usual political reasons,
    But surely, if the boats weren’t automatically seized and burned on arrival, and their crews thrown in the slammer…..They might just use boats that are seaworthy, with proper crews and there’d way less tragedy at sea.

    Alas, like the inane nonsense of the “war on drugs”, the crusade against the “evil people smugglers” is far too juicy a talking point for either the politicians or the media to give up.

  • 3
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 1:53 pm | Permalink

    Great article. I would like to point out that the Libs have framed this bill as being for or aganst the Malaysia Solution, but the bill makes no mentoion of Malaysia, it just allows off shore processing on places that have signed up to the bali process and includes oversihgt by the UNHCR and the red cross.

    The Pav- “Yet again he has failed the test and is siezing on the issue for political advantage and failing any test as a decent hman being.” Well said, Abbott’s “I am happy t negotiate as long as they do as I say” attiutde on this should make everyone thank the independents for backing gillard.

  • 4
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 1:55 pm | Permalink

    A special note of disdain should be reserved for Joe Hockey. He almost made me sick last night — not directly from watching but from almost smashing something heavy within arms reach into my plasma screen (the ultimate in true petite bourgoise sense of priorities!).

    No really. Either he sincerely believes the B-grade (or let’s call it zee-grade) Hollywood weepie script and he has mush for brains. Or, he is the most cynical and profoundly disrespectful of human life/asylum seekers of the lot.

    It was beyond parody though we’ll see what Clark & Dawe do tonight.

    BK seems to have an inexplicable soft spot for Hockey but most of us dread him as possible Treasurer. (To deploy the Irish joke, I have a soft spot for Joe too: a bog in northern Ireland. … just joking, no Alan Jones-like intent. Let’s just hope he gets a harmless ministry like Community Affairs or something…)

  • 5
    John Walters
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 1:57 pm | Permalink

    Leaving aside for the moment the despicable actions of the politicians of all stripes, let us consider the refugees themselves.

    They:
    are mostly young adults with a full working life in front of them;
    are educated;
    all have (or had) thousands of dollars to pay to people smugglers.

    Don’t we want to encourage emigrants who:
    are mostly young adults with a full working life in front of them;
    are educated;
    all have thousands of dollars to bring with them.

    Nahhh, let ‘em drown.

  • 6
    karol.florek
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:06 pm | Permalink

    Don’t like the questions or the answers? That’s what we’re stuck with.”

    This poisonous ‘debate’ is cynically framed in humanitarian terms, as a question between life or death at sea, premised on stopping the ‘evil people smugglers’ at all costs. But as many refugee advocates have long aruged, Government policies aimed at stopping ‘people smuggling’ are directly responsible for increasing the risks of sea voyages for asylum seekers, and make up the single largest contribution to deaths at sea. From an excellent analysis put together by the Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, ‘5 steps to address deaths at sea’:

    If the Australian government’s prime concern was deaths at sea, it would do all it could to ensure the seaworthiness of boats on route to Australia. One immediate action the government can take is to remove its harsh people smuggling sentencing laws along with the policy of confiscating asylum seeker boats. These policies only incentivise people smugglers to utilise vessels that are unseaworthy, overcrowded and manned by inexperienced, uninformed and often desperate and underage Indonesians, altogether increasing the risk of a tragedy at sea.”

    http://www.championsofchange.org.au/?p=882

  • 7
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

    I don’t get the article. How is the Greens’ insistence on onshore processing costing refugee lives?

  • 8
    CHRISTOPHER DUNNE
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

    Yes sadly, I agree with every word. and watching the histrionic performances of those politicians who were discovering their ‘consciences’ was utterly nauseating.

    Big Joe’s “over my dead body” was the nadir, as he stood on a pile of corpses to wave his flag which said “Moral High Ground”.

    Disgust is not a strong enough word for him, or the tearful sobs of SHY in the Senate, crying over the rough life of one refugee but not the bodies of the ones who drowned. Hypocrisy is a viral epidemic in Canberra.

  • 9
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:15 pm | Permalink

    I suppose if I am going to pour scorn and disdain on Joe Hockey for his theatric tears, I should do the same for Sarah Hanson-Young whose tears are on the front page of the Age. I haven’t seen the context (the video) but yes I don’t think it is a consistent philosophy.

    She said: “It entrenches danger. We need a regional solution.”

    D’oh, what is the Malaysian solution? And it goes a fair way towards the Greens desire to increase the overall asylum seeker intake. This is the inflexibility of a child; and I am a Greens supporter.

    Perhaps the Greens should allow a conscience vote (surely a tradition for their party?). Unfortunately even if all Greens abstained from voting the Coalition would still win, 34 to 31 (it would normally be 32 with Xenophon but he is in hospital). It would need at least two conscience-struck Libs to abstain or one or two Greens to break ranks with most Greens abstaining.

    No, the vote is lost.

    Can I bear to watch the sleazy unctuous words of Erica Betz and George Brandis. No, my plasma screen would be a goner.

  • 10
    mikeb
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:18 pm | Permalink

    I couldn’t stomach the entire “question time” session yesterday as what i saw made me sick. The Bishop kiss topped it all off. The greens will cope the heat for Senate rejection but they are small players if both parties can, for once, stop playing politics and do something that’s right for a change. Buffoon Hockey and sh*t happens Abbott are a disgrace.

  • 11
    Sam
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:20 pm | Permalink

    A pretty sickening display yesterday from the Coalition as they dragged out time to do no more than say the same things over and over. Perhaps there were some heartfelt utterances but given the way they voted in the end, they might as well have all taken the Andrew Robb and Sophie Mirabella path of political point scoring instead.

  • 12
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:23 pm | Permalink

    John Walters, please inform yourself and engage your brain. it is simply not true that it is “the despicable actions of the politicians of all stripes”.

    Labor have bent over backwards on this. The intransigence logjam can be laid at the feet mostly of Tony Abbott & Scott Morrison (who is the equal of Ruddick). And the idiocy/inflexibility/naivity of the Greens. There is a time to bend a bit and this is it. Who would want to form a government with them again? I had such hopes and they have generally done well but this reveals the worst of their inflexible ideology. Does Bob Brown not have a bit of sage advice to his former colleagues.

  • 13
    Andrew McIntosh
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:25 pm | Permalink

    Don’t like the questions or the answers? That’s what we’re stuck with.”

    What we are stuck with, then, is a pile of stinking shit and should be treated as such, not poked through to save bits of something salvageable. It would be the easiest, most honest and most honourable thing to do to simply let people come in and process them here in the general community - screw the detention centres, screw the “solutions”, screw frightening people into using crap boats with crews that don’t know what they’re doing, screw this bullshit “people smuggling” tag that’s just a bolster for gutless racism. But the issue that shouldn’t be an issue is so bogged down by the stupid and un-workable concept of “stopping the boats” that the simple, obvious option is considered beyond the pale. So, we get shit; not compassion, not action, not leadership, not anything worth anything, but shit. And just ‘cause I’m stuck with it doesn’t mean I, or anyone else, has to like it.

  • 14
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:29 pm | Permalink

    214 Afghans were slaughtered at home last week, would us denying refuge to people who did not drown stop them being slaughtered in Afghanistan.

    You have descended into the delusional group think in the big house.

    We have zero right to stop one person leaving home and claiming refuge status.

  • 15
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:31 pm | Permalink

    DOWN AND OUT OF SÀI GÒN at 2:14 pm |
    “I don’t get the article. How is the Greens’ insistence on onshore processing costing refugee lives?”

    I hope you are stuck in HCM city with poor dial-up to excuse your dumb blindness!

    The Greens have effectively dictated current policy by default: ONSHORE PROCESSING

    Have you not noticed it is not working. Hundreds are drowning. And it will continue despite Hanson-Young’s tears. If the asylum quota was doubled it is entirely possible double the number would drown trying.

    For this very simple fact of life, it is not a gigantic philosophical dilemma or argument to think that perhaps another approach that many believe has half a chance of working, a test. A time-limited test, via Wilkie’s Sunset Clause.

    The only thing the Greens could lose is their naivety, and maybe (it really pains me to say it, thank goodness BB has departed) sanctimoniusness.

  • 16
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:35 pm | Permalink

    Michael R James - You beat me to it.

    Marilyn - I don’t think anyone is wanting to stop them leaving home to claim refugee status, they just don’t want them leaving indonesia in a boat.

  • 17
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:39 pm | Permalink

    Marilyn,

    Some of us can hold two thoughts at the same time. We want Australia out of Afghanistan, though we should give penance for the havoc we will leave behind. (And unfortunately I doubt it is going to be like Vietnam where we can go back years later as do-gooders, or even to spend our tourist dollars to support their economy.)

    One doesn’t have to advocate that boat people asylum seekers should not try to reach our shores. Or that we should not accept a lot more.

    But that does not stop someone thinking of ways to minimize the drownings, even as I agree that these asylum seekers know roughly what risks they are taking and have made a more or less informed judgement on going ahead with that risk. They have that right and I accept that. (And that very fact will make these people some of the best citizens a country could wish for.)

    Still, does that stop us from trying to minimize it? I am sympathetic with a lot of your posts but do you have anything positive to add except let them come (and therefore let them drown) and accept them as refugees?

  • 18
    michael r james
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    S Y-H said in the Senate this morning:
    .
    “It entrenches danger,” she said. “We need a regional solution.”
    .
    Senator Hanson-Young called on the government to have urgent talks with Indonesia and to give funds directly to the UNHCR, Indonesia and Malaysia to make people safer ”in their ports”.
    .
    The senator choked up when she recalled the plight of refugee “Hussein” and his long and dangerous journey to reach Australia.
    .
    “These are the lives of the people we are playing with,” she said.
    .
    “This bill does nothing to protect Hussein”.

    Let me impersonate Marilyn: for f*cks sake, Sarah, slap yourself around the head a few times and wake up! It is your policy that is doing nothing to protect little Hussein. You’re a Senator so go over** and have it out with Indonesia with their 50,000 refugees amongst their 200 million mostly very poor citizens; or 90,000 in Malaysia. These countries rightly disdain our pathetic miserable handwringing xenophobia if not outright ra*ism to a small number of boat people — about 2% of last year’s immigrant intake.
    ………………..
    **Of course it is not legal for someone who is not part of the government to negotiate foreign policy (or anything else) with a foreign state.

  • 19
    SusieQ
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:48 pm | Permalink

    No one can take any credit for what is happening in parliament at the moment, but for Labour to even consider Naura and TPV’s is beyond the pale.
    Nice to see an article pointing out the hypocrisy of all our pollies over this.

  • 20
    Tony Mulligan
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:49 pm | Permalink

    ??

  • 21
    Kate
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 2:55 pm | Permalink

    What’s worse, getting caned in Malaysia, or drowning between Indonesia and Christmas Island?”
    This makes it sound as though these are the only 2 alternatives. Not true.

    Offshore processing doesn’t stop boats from capsizing and it doesn’t stop boats. It is a decision about where to send people once boats have been intercepted.

    If the aim is really to save lives as both sides are currently claiming then we need a different debate altogether.

  • 22
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:03 pm | Permalink

    Kate - “Offshore processing doesn’t stop boats from capsizing and it doesn’t stop boats. It is a decision about where to send people once boats have been intercepted.” But does it remove the incentive to get on the boat? That is to say if you were awaiting refugee processing in Malaysia or indonesia and were deciding wheterh or not to get on a boat to make a claim in Australia would you still do it if it meant you would simply be returned? Would you risk everything to gain nothing?

  • 23
    Kate
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:09 pm | Permalink

    Another way to remove the incentive to get on a boat would be to create more access to processing in Indonesia and Malaysia. This would mean you wouldn’t have to use cruelty as a disincentive.

  • 24
    Owen Gary
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:13 pm | Permalink

    The governments policy is the only one that makes sense, Abbott is as low as you can go, he will not yield unlike Beasley who did for Howard on this issue under the same circumstances. It will stop people drowning & drastically reduce this situation. I doub’t that anything will completely curtail it though, and that is the harsh reality to this.

    There are refugees who have been sitting in Indo/Malaya for years, they are all refugees & they have the right as much as anyone else who can afford to pay & jump onboard boats, what about those who are still left there but can’t afford to pay. Which of these is the more deserving??

    We would still receive over & above our quota, but you know within your own heart there must be some checks & balances. As a supporter of the Greens I do not support them on their fence sitting approach to this.

    The current world economic climate is fairly dire as well which means do we then stop citizens of other developed nations the same right in the near future as their economic systems collapse & they starve.

    It’s not a perfect world & as long as it is governed by a monetary system their will never be a perfect solution, only choices.

    What should the goverment do in light of all these events?????

    PS: Hockey doesn’t really need a mention, he has always been a bottom feeder, just the sight of him is deporable.

  • 25
    Kate
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:13 pm | Permalink

    Julian Burnside proposes processing centres in Indonesia as a possibility in this article -
    http://www.julianburnside.com.au/DeathAtSea.htm

  • 26
    Dogs breakfast
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:18 pm | Permalink

    Although, no doubt the headlines have already been written stating that this is a failure of the Labor Party, fact is that the greens and coalition should be ashamed if this bill doesn’t get up.

    The coalition, just diabolical, how they can show their faces in public is beyond me. The greens, well their insistence on onshore processing is exactly the incentive that is needed to get in a leaky boat from Indo.

    They may be technically right, but their choice will invite others to take on that risk, and some will die.

    Get over it Greens and show you have a brain as well as a heart. We can’t rely on the coalition, even with Judi Moylan and the few others with sense.

    Appalled.

  • 27
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:18 pm | Permalink

    Kate - I am all for Australia taking more refugee’s (which by the way is part of the Malaysia deal) but when Michael R James is saying “Indonesia with their 50,000 refugees amongst their 200 million mostly very poor citizens; or 90,000 in Malaysia.” HOw much more access would you need to create to remove the incentive? And don’t forget to factor in the pulling power of the increased chances of an Afghan getting to safety and prosperity if they go to the area of increased access.

  • 28
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:20 pm | Permalink

    Dogd breakfast - “Although, no doubt the headlines have already been written stating that this is a failure of the Labor Party” Look at the Herald Sun’s front page today, Abbott’s offers compromise of taking more refugee’s but Gillard say Malaysia must stay”. Almost the exact opposite of real ity.

  • 29
    zut alors
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:21 pm | Permalink

    Yes, MPs behaved better than usual and the parliament was shamed - but not sufficiently. I stopped listening to the debate after a couple hours, my gut foretold how it would end.

    What a showy shower our representatives mostly are, no evidence of statesmanship in either House.

    It won’t be long now before Brandis blames increased asylum demands on the carbon tax…

  • 30
    GeeWizz
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:24 pm | Permalink

    3 Questions Labor needs to answer on their Malaysian Non-Solution:

    1. What happens on the 801st Boat Arrival? What do they do then?

    2. Are they going to be sending unaccompanied 5 year olds onto the streets of Malaysia?

    3. If they don’t plan on sending unaccompanied kids to Malaysia, will they take rsponsibility when people smugglers start packing the boats full of kids and the boat sinks?

    That is all….

  • 31
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:26 pm | Permalink

    Kate - “Julian Burnside proposes processing centres in Indonesia as a possibility in this article” Great idea, but again how many refugee’s are going to be processed there compared with how many want to come here? And under the proposed law any boat arrivals could be returned to Inodnesia for processing under the libs & greens proposals that couldn’t happen.

  • 32
    Owen Gary
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:27 pm | Permalink

    We must also remember these are not permanent solutions only stop gaps. More population growth on the planet equals more displaced and impoverished people.

  • 33
    Owen Gary
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:29 pm | Permalink

    I guess a referendum is the only way to break this deadlock on this issue.

  • 34
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:31 pm | Permalink

    Geewizz -

    1) 1. What happens on the 801st Boat Arrival? What do they do then? Who will be volunteering to be the first 800 to chew up the quota? Do you think there are 800 people willing to part with over $10k to end up in Malaysia just so the 801st can get in?

    2. Are they going to be sending unaccompanied 5 year olds onto the streets of Malaysia? Already stated that they aren’t, despite Hockey’s tears.

    3. If they don’t plan on sending unaccompanied kids to Malaysia, will they take rsponsibility when people smugglers start packing the boats full of kids and the boat sinks? And the difference to the Libs Nauru policy is? Are they planning on sending unaccompanied 5 year olds to Nauru?

  • 35
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:34 pm | Permalink

    Owen we can’t have a referendum over it. What would the question be? Should we be allowed to kill people at home and then pretend we care if they drown after they leave.

    Bernard, censoring out the fact that we let them drown will not prevent that being the truth you pathetic Andrew Bolt wannabe

  • 36
    margbozik
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:35 pm | Permalink

    Who are refugees? They are our future doctors, lawyers, business people and academics.

    In 1938 an international conference was held in Evian, France, to discuss the problem of large numbers of Jewish refugees. At this conference, the Australian delegate spoke against allowing Jewish refugees to settle in Australia:

    As we have no real racial problem, we are not desirous of importing one by encouraging any scheme of large-scale foreign migration…

    - Thomas Walter White

    And historians. Australia definitely needs to learn from history.

  • 37
    Anwar Sukkar
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:36 pm | Permalink

    Ahh the price people are paying to keep our politician’s egos pumped, why does the obvious elude our leaders, Nauru worked try it again if it doesn’t work then we’ll try something else, but Julia would rather swap 800 for 4000 refugees and close to a billion $s because she can’t admit the other side got it right. I call our leaders these days the “Clayton’s leaders” the leaders you have when you don’t have leaders.

  • 38
    Owen Gary
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:37 pm | Permalink

    Put this to the nation a REFERENDUM is the only choice. The pollies must let the people decide once & for all.

  • 39
    Suzanne Blake
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:38 pm | Permalink

    The Oakeshott Bill will fail in the Senate and tomorrow, the heat will be on dishonest Gillard again.

  • 40
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:41 pm | Permalink

    Anwar - “Nauru worked try it again” Despite the advise from the architect of the Nauru policy that it won’t work now?

    And why not try Malaysia to see if it might not be better? Where would we be if the answer to everything was this works let’s not attempt anything else.

    And in case you had missed it the govt has compromised to include Nauru.

  • 41
    GeeWizz
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:42 pm | Permalink

    Great article. I would like to point out that the Libs have framed this bill as being for or aganst the Malaysia Solution, but the bill makes no mentoion of Malaysia, it just allows off shore processing on places that have signed up to the bali process and includes oversihgt by the UNHCR and the red cross.”

    HANG ON HANG ON HANG ON!!

    Lets just SEE which countries exactly are in this “Rob Oakeshott” test of human compassion called the “Bali Process”.

    Heres the list:
    www .baliprocess.net/index.asp?pageID=2145831409

    And heres a couple of highlights:
    Afghanistan
    China
    Cambodia
    Iran
    Iraq
    Jordan
    Pakistan
    Sri Lanka
    Syria
    Vietnam

    So the question has to be asked…. why the Fck did Oakeshott even bother requiring a “Bali Process” country to be part of the Bill?

    Why not just say… hey…. Australia can ship you wherever the god damn where we like? I mean if you can send someone back to Iran to be processed…. then what kind of lame-a55 test is the “Oakeshott Bali Process” requirement?

    I mean why doesn’t Oakeshott just put in his Bill that Australia can only send illegals back to countries with stars in their flags…. oh oh… I know… countries that begin with a random letter pulled out of a hat. That would be a good one.

  • 42
    TroppoTom
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:49 pm | Permalink

    To paraphrase John Donne: Never call out for whom the bell tolls, You might have to do something.
    What a disgrace this Parliament and its point scoring posturing chest thumping oillies are. As Derryn Hinch used to say: Shame Shame Shame!

  • 43
    shepherdmarilyn
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:49 pm | Permalink

    Independent Rob Oakeshott has introduced to the House of Representatives his own Migration Legislation Amendment (The Bali Process) Bill 2012. If passed, this bill would amend the Migration Act removing the peg on which the High Court was able to hang the Malaysia solution out to dry. Under the unamended law, the Minister for Immigration is required to declare in writing that any country to be used for offshore processing provides access to effective procedures for asylum claims, provides protection for asylum seekers while their claims are processed, and meets relevant human rights standards in providing that protection. In August last year, the High Court of Australia ruled that the Minister could not make a valid declaration in relation to Malaysia as it was not a signatory to the Refugees Convention, and the Arrangement between the two governments was not legally binding.

    Oakeshott is proposing that a new peg replace the old one, and that the new one be designed such that Malaysia could pass muster without High Court interference. His bill would permit the Minister to designate Malaysia as an offshore assessment country because it is a party to the Bali Process which at its last meeting a year ago included 32 countries working on a Regional Cooperation Framework. If Oakeshott intended meaningful public decision making by the Executive government and appropriate parliamentary scrutiny, he has failed. Participation in the Bali process could not be reckoned a sufficient precondition for a country to pass muster with human rights protection and appropriate asylum procedures. For example, Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran are all participants in the Bali process.

    The only other precondition in the Oakeshott bill is that “the Minister thinks it is in the national interest” to designate a country as an offshore assessment country. Anxious to avoid any further High Court scrutiny, his drafters have stipulated that the international obligations and domestic laws of a country are irrelevant to the process of designation. In considering whether designation of another country would be in Australia’s national interest, the Minister is required to have regard to the assurances offered by that country’s government about the assessment of asylum claims and the non-refoulement of asylum seekers whose claims have not yet been decided. These assurances need not be legally binding. The Minister is required to place a statement of reasons before Parliament within 2 sitting days of making a designation. He is also required within 14 days to make a request of UNHCR and the International Organisation for Migration (IOM) seeking a formal statement of their views about the arrangements proposed in the designated country. It would make more sense if the minister were required to make the requests and receive the statements before making his decision to designate a country, and before tabling the decision in Parliament. That way the UNHCR and IOM positions could help to inform both the Minster’s decision and Parliament’s assessment of the decision. The bill provides that “the sole purpose of laying the documents before the Parliament is to inform the Parliament of the matters referred to in the documents and nothing in the documents affects the validity of the designation”. Parliament has no power to disallow the designation and a failure to table the documents would not affect the validity of the designation. So the Oakeshott peg is designed to ensure that neither Parliament nor the High Court could hang a designated country out to dry, ever again. The bill is simply a convoluted means for allowing the Executive government to declare an offshore processing country without any meaningful scrutiny by Parliament or the High Court. It does nothing to advance the cause of public scrutiny of government decisions to provide offshore processing of asylum claims.

    A completely toothless tiger, the bill still provides the opportunity for Parliament to agitate again the debate about Nauru, Malaysia and onshore processing.

  • 44
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:51 pm | Permalink

    Geewizz - Once again you manage to only see half the story, if you read the end of the sentence “includes oversight by the UNHCR and the red cross” you would see that under the bill the minister would have to table the UNHCR’s & the Red crosses opinion on the policy in the parliament.

    And just because those countries are signatories doesn’t mean they have to be used. For the sake of completeness maybe you could post how many countires are signatories to the UNHCR agreemnt and how many are signatories to the bali process?

    You also left off the your list places such as the USA, Japan, Vanuatu, Tonga, PNG, Malaysia, Indonesia, the Phillipines, New Zealand & Korea.

  • 45
    GeeWizz
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:52 pm | Permalink

    1) 1. What happens on the 801st Boat Arrival? What do they do then? Who will be volunteering to be the first 800 to chew up the quota? Do you think there are 800 people willing to part with over $10k to end up in Malaysia just so the 801st can get in?”

    Amanda Vanstone pointed out the other night that first off the people smugglers will probably just pay people to get on the boats and once they are back in Malaysia just fly them back to Indonesia again onto the next boat until the quota is exhausted. 800 will be the target for the people smugglers to exhaust and seeing as the are currently doing 1200 a month I can see the policy being over in about 3 weeks.

    3. If they don’t plan on sending unaccompanied kids to Malaysia, will they take rsponsibility when people smugglers start packing the boats full of kids and the boat sinks? And the difference to the Libs Nauru policy is? Are they planning on sending unaccompanied 5 year olds to Nauru?”

    The difference is there will be no incentive to pack only kids on boats to fend for themselves because no matter your age you will get the same treatment on Nauru.

    Yes 5 year olds will go to Nauru under the care of Australian staff, in Australian accomodation, with Australian food to Australian standards. Not dumped on the street of Kuala Lumpa to work as a sex-worker

  • 46
    GeeWizz
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:54 pm | Permalink

    Geewizz - Once again you manage to only see half the story, if you read the end of the sentence “includes oversight by the UNHCR and the red cross””

    Ahh of course…. like the “U.N oversight” in Syria. Hows that going? The bombs dropped on the civilians then the U.N is allowed to go look 3 hours later after the body cleanup.

  • 47
    Owen Gary
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    Marilyn,

    I think under your green exterior you may be a co-alition quisling.

    If this is a mature democracy we live in & the goverment of the day is being impeeded the public should should vote with their feet & their own conscience.

  • 48
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 4:01 pm | Permalink

    Geewizz - “Ahh of course…. like the “U.N oversight” in Syria. Hows that going?” So you think only UNHCR signatory countries are good enough but don’t think UNHCR oversight does anything?

    Amanda Vanstone pointed out the other night that first off the people smugglers will probably just pay people to get on the boats and once they are back in Malaysia just fly them back to Indonesia again onto the next boat until the quota is exhausted” Ahhh Amanda said it so it must be true!

    The difference is there will be no incentive to pack only kids on boats to fend for themselves because no matter your age you will get the same treatment on Nauru.
    Yes 5 year olds will go to Nauru under the care of Australian staff, in Australian accomodation, with Australian food to Australian standards. Not dumped on the street of Kuala Lumpa to work as a sex-worker” So is Nauru a deterent or not? Under this proposal Nauru is going to be used so if sya all unaccompanied minors get sent to Nauru to be cared for be Australians and the rest get sent back to Malaysia where is the incentive to load boats with kids?

    And by the way the 801st boat person will be sent to Nauru at this stage so again where is the incentive to pay people to chew up the quota if Nauru works so well?

  • 49
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 4:04 pm | Permalink

    As Bernard has noted, reinstating Nauru could cost $1 billion. If Labor and the Coalition were really so concerned with saving lives, I’m sure they could think of something else to do with that money that would be more effective than locking people up behind razor wire.

    The risk of crossing the sea in a leaky boat is a pretty strong deterrent in itself. Piling additional, more punitive deterrents on top of that is increasingly heartless and ineffective, and is never going to stop all the boats anyway.

  • 50
    Jimmy
    Posted Thursday, 28 June 2012 at 4:09 pm | Permalink

    Form1planet - “The risk of crossing the sea in a leaky boat is a pretty strong deterrent in itself” Obviously not given the number of people willing to pay vast sums for the privilege!

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