Comments on: We’re not out of the woods … yet http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/ now with extra source Sun, 12 Feb 2012 01:59:31 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: napoleon dynamite http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-60033 napoleon dynamite Sun, 21 Feb 2010 21:35:14 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-60033 The problem is that global banks are still very short on liquidity, albeit it is improving, and still only lending to the very best credits. It is hard to grow when the capital isn't there. The mezzanine debt market is still basically non existant which is a good barometer for confidence. The only impact Greece will have on the economy is confidence, nothing else. Germany and France is mainland Europe, not Greece. Also, talk to any small business operator out there, they are finding it very difficult to obtain credit with most of their finance coming from their own resources i.e re-mortgaging their houses, overdrafts, cash etc. SME's have always been the life blood of our economy and they are still a long way off from levels enjoyed pre-GFC. Things could be worse. We could have Gordon Brown and the UK Labour Party as our Government! The problem is that global banks are still very short on liquidity, albeit it is improving, and still only lending to the very best credits. It is hard to grow when the capital isn’t there.

The mezzanine debt market is still basically non existant which is a good barometer for confidence. The only impact Greece will have on the economy is confidence, nothing else. Germany and France is mainland Europe, not Greece.

Also, talk to any small business operator out there, they are finding it very difficult to obtain credit with most of their finance coming from their own resources i.e re-mortgaging their houses, overdrafts, cash etc. SME’s have always been the life blood of our economy and they are still a long way off from levels enjoyed pre-GFC.

Things could be worse. We could have Gordon Brown and the UK Labour Party as our Government!

]]> By: Ben Aveling http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59286 Ben Aveling Wed, 17 Feb 2010 10:43:34 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59286 > Greece’s economic meltdown has nothing to do with the GFC and everything to do with having to still pay the bills 14 YEARS after its engorged Limpic sportsfest in 1996 left it broke. The Olympics probably didn't help, but Greece has been fudging the figures for a while. It was always going to end in tears sooner or later. That said, the GFC made it sooner than it might otherwise been, and probably made it worse. Certainly it makes it harder for the rest of the EU to bail Greece out. @John B. Infect is probably the right word. Most of the comments here are about MPM.

Greece’s economic meltdown has nothing to do with the GFC and everything to do with having to still pay the bills 14 YEARS after its engorged Limpic sportsfest in 1996 left it broke.

The Olympics probably didn’t help, but Greece has been fudging the figures for a while. It was always going to end in tears sooner or later. That said, the GFC made it sooner than it might otherwise been, and probably made it worse. Certainly it makes it harder for the rest of the EU to bail Greece out.

@John B.

Infect is probably the right word. Most of the comments here are about MPM.

]]> By: Peter Fuller http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59278 Peter Fuller Wed, 17 Feb 2010 09:48:30 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59278 While it's questionable if MPM is an economist s/he doesn't have much of a grip on Olympic history. Athens was 2004, Atlanta 1996. While it’s questionable if MPM is an economist s/he doesn’t have much of a grip on Olympic history. Athens was 2004, Atlanta 1996.

]]> By: John Bennetts http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59194 John Bennetts Wed, 17 Feb 2010 05:28:36 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59194 Infect?? try "infest". jb Infect?? try “infest”.
jb

]]> By: John Bennetts http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59193 John Bennetts Wed, 17 Feb 2010 05:27:00 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59193 MPM: And are you implying that you are an economist? Or, perhaps, a God? Please try harder to add value to the threads which you infect. MPM: And are you implying that you are an economist? Or, perhaps, a God? Please try harder to add value to the threads which you infect.

]]> By: Poseidon Burke http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59192 Poseidon Burke Wed, 17 Feb 2010 05:26:29 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59192 So the rush to debt financed stimulus spending without cost benefit consideration proves to be both unsustainable (unless we want more debt) and probably ineffective for avoding recession in the medium term? Sounds like a dumb idea got dumber. How about spending money to achieve substantial structural gains to national productivity? In response to David Sanderson (2:07) I say the stimulus as deployed was ill advised it was only at best a short term fix and it didnt deliver us sustainable advantages. A strategic resposne would have been to say the GFC presents an opportunity to furthe reform the Australian economy. Instead we have cash handouts and deadly insulation . So the rush to debt financed stimulus spending without cost benefit consideration proves to be both unsustainable (unless we want more debt) and probably ineffective for avoding recession in the medium term? Sounds like a dumb idea got dumber. How about spending money to achieve substantial structural gains to national productivity?

In response to David Sanderson (2:07) I say the stimulus as deployed was ill advised it was only at best a short term fix and it didnt deliver us sustainable advantages. A strategic resposne would have been to say the GFC presents an opportunity to furthe reform the Australian economy. Instead we have cash handouts and deadly insulation .

]]> By: Most Peculiar Mama http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59187 Most Peculiar Mama Wed, 17 Feb 2010 05:20:23 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59187 <i>"...It takes a peculiar kind of idiocy to deny the significance of the GFC. Some on the conservative side have no end of that kind of idiocy..."</i> Thank God you're not an economist. “…It takes a peculiar kind of idiocy to deny the significance of the GFC. Some on the conservative side have no end of that kind of idiocy…”

Thank God you’re not an economist.

]]> By: David Sanderson http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59152 David Sanderson Wed, 17 Feb 2010 04:13:59 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59152 Greece's problems are caused by chronic misgovernment by both the conservatives and the socialists, both of which are dynastic parties. The Olympics are only a small part of that overall failure.However, that chronic failure was brought to a head by the GFC. It takes a peculiar kind of idiocy to deny the significance of the GFC. Some on the conservative side have no end of that kind of idiocy. Greece’s problems are caused by chronic misgovernment by both the conservatives and the socialists, both of which are dynastic parties. The Olympics are only a small part of that overall failure.However, that chronic failure was brought to a head by the GFC.

It takes a peculiar kind of idiocy to deny the significance of the GFC. Some on the conservative side have no end of that kind of idiocy.

]]> By: Most Peculiar Mama http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59134 Most Peculiar Mama Wed, 17 Feb 2010 03:40:04 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59134 Why is Gail Kelly so convinced we are? And Greece's economic meltdown has nothing to do with the GFC and everything to do with having to still pay the bills 14 YEARS after its engorged Limpic sportsfest in 1996 left it broke. George Papandreou should send One Anchovy Sandwich the bill. Didn't Montreal teach the world anything? Why is Gail Kelly so convinced we are?

And Greece’s economic meltdown has nothing to do with the GFC and everything to do with having to still pay the bills 14 YEARS after its engorged Limpic sportsfest in 1996 left it broke.

George Papandreou should send One Anchovy Sandwich the bill.

Didn’t Montreal teach the world anything?

]]> By: David Sanderson http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59129 David Sanderson Wed, 17 Feb 2010 03:28:59 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59129 Who guy? Guy who? Who guy? Guy who?

]]> By: Pete from Sydney http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59115 Pete from Sydney Wed, 17 Feb 2010 03:11:12 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59115 "There’s a good long piece by Laura Tingle today (please don’t ask me for a link — go complain to Fairfax)".....or you could pay for it...like we're paying to read you right Guy? “There’s a good long piece by Laura Tingle today (please don’t ask me for a link — go complain to Fairfax)”…..or you could pay for it…like we’re paying to read you right Guy?

]]> By: David Sanderson http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/02/17/were-not-out-of-the-woods-yet/#comment-59111 David Sanderson Wed, 17 Feb 2010 03:07:13 +0000 http://www.crikey.com.au/?p=117302#comment-59111 And good luck trying to claim that the stimulus was never needed and should be entirely withdrawn now. Are you feeling lucky Tony? Huh, punk? And good luck trying to claim that the stimulus was never needed and should be entirely withdrawn now.

Are you feeling lucky Tony? Huh, punk?

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