Robertson locals turning on Belinda Neal
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A second ALP branch in Belinda Neal’s electorate of Robertson has rebelled against her candidacy for federal preselection, adding to a groundswell of grassroots support for alternative candidate Deb O’Neill. In an email sent last night to around 70 local ALP members, and obtained by Crikey, key Wamberal-Terrigal branch member Darryl Bowling, a longtime Neal loyalist, says he can no longer abide by the local member, whose profile suffered at the hands of 2008’s Iguanagate scandal. “Rightly or wrongly, I have concluded that it is impossible for you to again win the seat, and consequently in the best interests of Labor you should resign and good sense and logic would be to persuade your various supporters to redirect their efforts to assist in the election of Deborah O’Neill in your stead,” Bowling wrote. “Reluctantly, you must agree that Deb has all the antecedents of a prime candidate for Robertson, and it would be a great boost for Labor if you could be gracious and positively pass the baton. For Deb to win will not be a walk in the park, but at least there would be hope for Labor. “I am sorry to have to write to you on this subject and I wish no personal animosity.” In the email, Bowling reveals Neal contacted him to shore up his support just hours after Crikey revealed O’Neill’s looming challenge last Thursday. Bowling says Neal told him that Iguanagate, which led to Prime Minister Kevin Rudd ordering the federal member into anger management classes, was a “beat-up” concocted by News Limited tabloid the Daily Telegraph. The latest uprising will increase pressure on Neal after members of the Ourimbah Narara Valley branch passed a motion last week calling on her to resign for “the good of the nation”. The branch then faced a ‘rescission motion’ from Neal designed to overturn the vote. Crikey understands that the Wamberal-Terrigal branch has around 25 voting members with the eventual candidate selected via simple majority of around 150 members scattered among it and the nine other branches in the electorate. Nominations formally opened this morning and will run for nine days with the vote set to take place on March 6. Robertson is the most marginal seat in the country, with Neal clinging to a 0.1% buffer. Grassroots backing for Neal has always been tenuous. Contrary to claims in today’s Australian that she had “never faced” a ballot of members, in late 2000 Neal was defeated by Trish Moran by two votes — 87 to 85, a decision that was ratified by the ALP National Executive after Neal challenged it. The about-face at Wamberal-Terrigal will add to fears in the Neal camp that a local poll could draw widespread support for O’Neill, who ran for the state seat of Gosford in 2003. And there remains concerns over the legitimacy of some pro-Neal branches. Woy-Woy, of which Neal is a member, Kariong and Mangrove Mountain have been dubbed ‘ghost branches’ and their bona fides and meeting records have been questioned. While Neal’s hopes at Gosford will be assisted by the presence of staffers Paul Sullivan and Dez Karlsson, who will vote for their jobs, at Mooney Mooney she will face opposition from members who have declined requests from Neal to attend meetings. Hardy’s Bay, Umina and Kincumber are also believed to be teetering. Yesterday ABC1’s Insiders program reported Neal’s husband John Della Bosca had been hitting the phones alongside Neal in an attempt to derail the grassroots vote, a claim he angrily denied. |
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34 Comments
A committed local member, rather than a member who should be committed, can only be a win for the people of Robertson.
Belinda is going to need all that anger-management training that she never had.
I’m sure the people of Robertson will “know exactly who she is” when casting their vote for others.
As someone who lived for many years in that electorate, it amazes me that Neal lasted as long as she has. There is certainly no love for her in the community, and the long list of preferable candidates includes several marsupials and a couple of species of tree fungus.
Any alternative at all is only going to improve the odds of the ALP retaining the seat.
Oh, by the way, is Womberal where Wombles have holiday beach houses?
I’m no supporter of people who are rude, who bully, or who use their position to demand special treatment, BUT, I still feel that if Belinda was a man, her ‘behaviour’ would not have been such a focal issue.
For example, her husband John Della Bosca, who was also present on the night in question; who didn’t object to her behaviour at the time, or own up to bullying the staff still holds his seat in the Legislative Council, and to date, I haven’t heard that his position is under threat?
Rudd apparently has a short fuse and has used obscene language and yet he hasn’t been forced to undergo anger management counselling? Smacks of double standards, sexism, and lets me see that the ‘Damned Whores and God’s Police’ syndrome that Anne Summers called a book she wrote several yrs ago, is still alive and well!
To those who have trouble following this idea; on one hand women are treated as whores, who don’t deserve or receive respect, used as sexual ‘things’ etc(evidenced by sexual abuse, DV, rape in wars etc) and on the ‘god’s police’ aspect- we’re supposed to be the ones who protect men from themselves(their grotty behaviour; their inability to stop themselves re rape (it’s up to us to save them???)and uplift and raise community standards???God forbid that we utter profanities or engage in male behaviour - historically one with too many examples of bullying and being overbearing, who have the power to make all the rules that we must also comply with!
@Gibbot - amusing, perhaps it was always the Wombles of Womberal and Wimbledon was their holiday home? some great pubs in Wimbledon though…
Even ALP members appear to dislike Neal so she would be well advised by her lothario husband to disappear into the background for the good of the party. With such a small margin combined with the antics of Neal, what are the chances of the ALP even retaining this seat in Robertson?
Ruddism It’s like this: Neal has had her fair suck of the sauce bottle, and in the process she dribble a number of times. OK, she tried to clean the table cloth, but the stains remain. Deborah O’Neill is a smooth and diplomatic performer who will suck the bottle without a dribble - and the cloth will always be clean!
@Ty_Webb - apologies for appearing flippant. I actually take the matter pretty seriously. The Central Coast is my ‘spiritual home’ and it has not been represented for some time.
IMHO Neal retained her seat in 07 solely due to the electorate voting against the incumbent government - in particular against Howard personally. In any other election the candidate would have been scrutinized far more than what happened in this case.
A decent Labor candidate would shoe it in, but they would have to be well distanced from the state power base (ie Della Bosca) to have a fair crack. The Central Coast is essentially a blue collar zone - most of the affluent property owners don’t actually live there. They own holiday houses, and are held in disdain by long time locals.
If the Greens placed an articulate, non extremist candidate in the area there could be a sizable challenge to the major parties.
Wasn’t Belinda Neal at that place with her husband? Why aren’t male politicians sent to anger management? Doesn’t Kevin Rudd have an angry streak and reacted accordingly? Why hasn’t someone suggested that he have anger management? Why isn’t his position threatened? Didn’t Tony Abbott use some colourful language in recent times? What about the alleged poison that Senator Heffernan spun under parliamentary privilege about then Justice Michael Kirby?
I don’t condone rudeness or bullying no matter who says or does it, but I do challenge the sexist rubbish behind this situation. I don’t live in Ms Neal’s seat, nor am I condoning her alleged behaviour, but this hypocritical BS is just that - BS! Men can do as they please, women have to be pure as the driven snow!
Anyone who listens to parliament on a regular basis must have seen politicians(mostly men) behaving in at best an immature and pathetic manner. Of course, they’ve voiced the words of the lord’s prayer prior to question time, so that must make their behaviour OK????????
I don’t think anyone in the parliament, male or female, could match the weird nastiness of this hissed attack on a pregnant Sophie Mirabella (Mirabella can be pretty nasty herself but is not in the Neal league):
“evil thoughts will turn your unborn child into a demon”
hehe spot on David!
Neal is a nasty piece of work, male or female - haven’t figured that one out yet.
But what a dysfunctional family they have, her husband knocks around with 20 year old females and Neal looks for bar fights in her spare time.
It must be a lonely place when even her peers do not like her.
@Liz 45
I think you will find that Della Bosca got his come uppance over a later much publicized affair.
David Sanderson that is a specious attack on Neal which refuses to acknowledge that Mirrabella was interjecting and suggesting that Neal was not a woman. Mirrabella’s evil thoughts were an offence to women everywhere and Neal was right to react. I dare say her baby will grow up to be a right wing f*ckhead, if not an actual demon.
Michael James you should pull back on your ongoing attack on people with mental disabilities, I mean if Rham emanuel said such a thing……………….
SBH: “Neal was right to react. I dare say her baby will grow up to be a right wing f*ckhead, if not an actual demon.”
That you think this is acceptable indicates only your inability to adhere to decent standards.
Why? That makes no sense. Firstly is there a book that codifies ‘decent standards’ or did you just make them up. Second, this typifies the double standard at work with Neal.why is it wrong for Neal to respond to a vile attack on her humanity? Third what’s the preciousness about Mirrabella’s baby, how did her pregnancy transform her from a nasty right-wing attack dog to a delicate flower incapable of standing up to parliamentary unpleasantness. Mirrabella is a nasty peice of work and feels quite free to slag other women off as she cynically uses her own pregnancy as some sort of special protection. Any child raised with by mother who specialises in nasty right-wing attacks will invariably grow up a distorted and dmaged human being. Someone should call the welfare.
If you want to attack Neal for her comments then have the….erhmm…decency to tell the whole story.
You’re right about MPM by theway
Michael James - I agree with SBH re your comment re mental illness. We’re growing up in this country, eventually, slowly, about those suffering from a mental illness - we don’t refer to people as ‘retards’ anymore either??Or do we? Due to the horrific lack of attention to those suffering from a mental illness, and their supportive loved ones who can’t get adequate treatment for them, including at times, the sadness of having them committed for their own health needs and safety, using this type of comment is not funny! OK? May I suggest you read Anne Deverson’s book about her son Johathan, who suffered from a mental illness for several yrs, and finally committed suicide. You, like I would hopefully be shocked by his struggles and his mother’s quest for adequate treatment! It’s called, ‘Tell me I’m here’? This is what he used to ask his mother on a constant basis! Very sad!
DAVID SANDERSON - You obviously didn’t have a problem with the comment Michael James made either? Says a lot about you too!
REALIST - John Della Bosca is still there though, with no conversation re his future position. He didn’t rape that woman, it was consensual, so what’s your problem? I still maintain, that male politicians get away with a lot worse than women do-the ‘Damned Whores and God’s Police’ syndrome(Anne Summers book - you should read it) Women, as a general rule are placed in these 2 categories - we’re supposed to be the ‘god’s police’ in society - protecting those poor men who are unable to stop themselves or whatever; to set the community standards - in a community where men make all the rules, and inform us of who and why we should pay! The ‘Damned whores” component is sadly still alive and well in the treatment dished out to women by too many men - physical, sexual, social abuse; sexual harrassment and DV - lack of respect and treating women as sexual objects. Who made the laws pertaining to these activities? Men! Who have had to fight to have them ammended or removed altogether? Women! Look at yourselves people! Take a look at the male politicians in the parliament - some are just plain bloody rude! good christians though????
The TV is full of bad language; most males swear, using 4 letter words etc; I’ve never heard of a male politician, including the PM undergoing anger management for swearing at staff, air line personnel or the general public. Sophie is not a ‘wilting flower’ she can stand up for herself, and if she kept on goading(as I hear constantly while listening the Parliament - drives me nuts?) then I could understand the recipient responding out of combined frustration/anger!
It is a pity you need a book to know what decent standards are. As I made clear from the beginning Mirabella is pretty nasty herself and is certainly deserving of severe criticism.
However Neal’s remark goes way beyond any normal “parliamentary unpleasantness”. Attacking the children, unborn or otherwise, of your opponents is beyond the pale and that you think it is fair game demonstrates, as I said, an inability to adhere to decent standards.
Her attack was very weirdly nasty and certainly, along with all the other stuff, casts huge doubt on her suitability to be an MP.
LIZ45, your comment about me is exceptionally silly. Saying, or implying, that a politician is mad is standard political abuse and I wonder why anyone would be bothered to comment on that.
Neal’s remark is definitely very non-standard and, as many of her branch members are saying, will cause her a lot of harm at the ballot box if she does not stand down.
David she was cautioning Mirabella on the effect her ongoing vituperative denunciation of women would have on the poor innocent in her womb. She was demonstrably not attacking the baby.
But to the other point, why only give one side of that exchange? Because that’s what people do when they attack Neal, select the published bits of her behaviour that suits there case. Why don’t we talk about her forgiving nature when her old man made an old fool of himself? Gibbots the only one whose made a relevant comment about her actual performance as a local member.
And I don’t need a book or you to define decent behaviour. Our definitions differ.
“David she was cautioning Mirabella on the effect her ongoing vituperative denunciation of women would have on the poor innocent in her womb. She was demonstrably not attacking the baby.”
You may believe your own bullshit but I don’t think you will get many other takers. The mental gymnastics required to not believe that the attack on Mirabella was not made ‘through’ her unborn child are gymnastics that the bulk of the Robertson electorate will, thankfully, be unable to perform.
As for why she deserves electoral credit for “forgiving” John, well that one entirely defeats my reasoning powers, and again, that of her electorate.
DDavid - “LIZ45, your comment about me is exceptionally silly. Saying, or implying, that a politician is mad is standard political abuse and I wonder why anyone would be bothered to comment on that.”
No it’s not, and your insistence otherwise is part of the problem. It’s the same as sexist or racist jokes - they’re told ad infinitum, it doesn’t make them funnier? There are many comments people make, thoughtlessly, and don’t spend time to think if they could hurt someone - I refuse to laugh at these things, and have often been told that I lack a sense of humour - I don’t? I just refuse to laugh at peoples’ struggles etc, particularly when I’ve spoken to those who it affects - blacks, women and people with a mental illness.
In fact, there’s a lovely bloke who lives in my complex, and he’s had an ongoing struggle with mental illness for years. We’ve had chats about his health and community attitudes - he’s been bashed(sorry restrained?) by local police as well. I’ve promised him, that like racism etc, I’ll never allow even so-called harmless references at people who have a mental illness. I’ve also told him that I thought I was educated and compassionate, but the above book really opened my eyes - it’s well worth a read. Ann Deveson is well known in this country as a wonderful journalist and documentary maker, and she writes very well. It’s only a small book, but her love and desperation can be felt - that’s if you are capable of feeling empathy??
Politicians can behave badly; lack intelligence; be argumentative and frustrating; they can be rude and act like bullies; be childish and ignorant; some are immature and not capable of concern let alone empathy, and some are just hard core and don’t give a s**t, like those who organised worstchoices and the policies that affect asylum seekers - some of these have thankfully been changed? Or be like a breath of fresh air - there are 2 wonderful labor women in my city and the bordering one, who work hard and have achieved much - there’s never been a whisper of anything resembling bad behaviour.
As I said, I’m no fan of Belinda Neal, haven’t met her or her husband, but I’ve seen and heard worse behaviour than hers, and they(men usually) have got away with it or just got a slap on the wrist! Sexist and divisive and unjust!
Bullshit David? I say that’s hardly decent! as a rule it’s not hard to defeat your reasoning powers. All it takes is to ask you why you refuse to give both sides of a nasty exchange and focus on one comment to define a person’s worth.
Er and Neal retracted her remark but Mirabella did not. How does that stack up against standards of decent behaviour?
Or being deliberately absent when the apology to the stolen generations was given,
or denying there were stolen generations
or calling Malcolm Fraser a liar or Petro Georgiou a terrorist
No poor old Soph is really one to stick up for in this contest on ‘decency’
David Sanderson - I think the ball’s in your court! How do you justify those little gems Sophia said? She’s a very nasty little woman, and by the sounds of it, I’d make a caustic comment in response to her persistent goading - then she cries, little a little child, hurt in the playground? As SBH said, at least she apologized? I haven’t heard Sophia apologize for calling aboriginal people liars, or Petro a terrorist etc. I thought the Libs were supposed to believe in freedom of speech, and their party is a “broad church” where members can have different points of view unlike the “Stalinist attitudes of the labor party” as Abbott responded to Malcolm Turnbull’s embarrassing commitment to the govt’s CPRS? Who’s to bet that the head office of the Libs will be scuttling around for someone to take Malcolm’s place? So much for their ‘freedom of speech’ attitude?
Oh yes, and they’re so democratic in the Liberal party, that Abbott has told members in David Clarke’s area not to contest him for the next state election! What happened to democracy among party members, not to mention the headquarters of NSW? Democracy my foot! It’s BS!
PS. They’re so proud of their party, that Jo Gash’s recent letter box drop doesn’t mention the Liberal party once! Not once! Her electorate of Grosby has been changed, and she has citizens in the Throsby electorate to convince prior to the next federal election? Her tactic? Don’t even mention the Liberal party??????Go take a look, it might be on her website!
PS. At least Belinda apologized I meant! David Clarke is a member of the MLC in NSW! A nice little right wing bigot from the far right of the catholic church!
“Bullshit David? I say that’s hardly decent!”
You may think that is a clever debating point but it isn’t. Vigour in debate is decent, vile personal abuse is not. You have been unable to understand this point thus far.
“Neal retracted her remark”
Neal made a retraction but did not retract what she actually said. She has never admitted that she said it, further diminishing her standing.
Your attempt to paint me as supporting Mirabella is ridiculous and dishonest, as a reading of my post would make clear. Her political invective goes beyond what is politically acceptable but it is political, not an intensely personal attack of the kind Neal made.
Your attitude is indicative of a wider problem in parts of the left. It goes something like this:
I’m left and I believe in things that are good and wonderful. My opponents on the right believe things that are awful and bad. Because they believe things that are awful and bad I don’t need to treat them with any personal decency and and a lot of pretty nasty tactics are acceptable to use against them because they deserve it because, not only do they believe bad things, but they are also very bad people.
Ordinary people, like the electors of Robertson, don’t accept this self-serving reasoning. They believe that both side of the debate ought to behave towards one another with a certain level of personal decency. That belief will go heavily against her if she remains the candidate.
I think you are spot on David. Btw, I have noticed on Crikey that once you show your political colours, sadly, you are cannon fodder for the other side regardless. A fair portion of comments are aggressive, insulting and puerile.
I support the Greens but wouldn’t hesitate to call Neal, Abbott or Brown, for that matter, a goose if they deserved it. It is impossible to paint Neal in a positive light and yes, her attack on Mirrabella was quite nasty. Also, did I miss something? how did gender equality come into the thread?
so Dave, Sophi’s vile personal abuse is unacceptable? You know, where she vilified Neal for not being a real woman. I mean get that bit. I just don’t get why your not even handed about what was said. That’s not left or right. That’s just honest.
Neal is portrayed as some kind of monster because of one incident. That’s politics but it’s not honest or fair and it’s a poor way to select our parliamentarians. If you think what Neal said was the worst of what’s said inParliament then you should read more uncorrected hansard. Or watch “Keating, the musical”. I would urge you to uses your sense of decency less and your brains more.
BTW I doubt you’re an elector of Robertson and you’re certainly not going to get a pre selection vote so stop trying to pretend you know what they think. As for decency and vigour in debate you’ll see if you look back through the posts (Look back, read and consider, don’t just knee jerk) that you started sling insults at posters well before I did.
Ty_webb how so. If you track my comments you’ll find your contention difficult to support. When Dave says something sensible I’ll agree with him as I did earlier today.
“You know, where she vilified Neal for not being a real woman.”
As I said earlier attacks upon the children, born or unborn, of an opponent are at a level of nastiness and noxiousness considerably above personal attacks upon an opponent. You didn’t understand how beyond the pale they are when you made the attacks below and you obviously still don’t.
“I dare say her baby will grow up to be a right wing f*ckhead, if not an actual demon.”
AND
“Any child raised with by mother who specialises in nasty right-wing attacks will invariably grow up a distorted and dmaged human being. Someone should call the welfare.”
“Neal is portrayed as some kind of monster because of one incident”
I have not said she is a monster. I have said that she is not suited to be an MP. As you know there is much more than one incident behind the party push to force her out of the seat. On the other hand you have portrayed Mirabella, without good cause, as someone who is so warped and monstrous that any child of hers should be removed for its own well-being.
“As for decency and vigour in debate you’ll see if you look back through the posts (Look back, read and consider, don’t just knee jerk) that you started sling insults at posters well before I did.”
This is just silly. When you accused me of a lack of decency for using the word “bullshit” you were using a prim, Victorian definition of the word which I obviously wasn’t.
Calling me “Dave” is odd. You don’t know me and you would not call me that if you did. It seems you are using this diminutive as a pathetic attempt to somehow diminish me. Peculiar.
“you’re certainly not going to get a pre selection vote”
This suggests that you are a preselector yourself or in some way involved in the process. You ought to reveal where you are coming from in this argument. If you are a friend or associate of Neal’s then you should say so.
“stop trying to pretend you know what they think”
There is no pretending. Plenty have said what they think, including from her own branches. Overwhelmingly the view has been unfavourable.
I disagree Dave, I understand that you think children should not be dragged into politics and I look forward to your vigorous denunciation of the next right winger to do so.
Sophie Mriabella is every bit as unpleasant as Neal and her calculated and deliberate refusal to participate in an apology to Australias most abused and marginalised people (That was about children too Dave, stolen ones but I guess that it’s different for libs) is far worse than Neal’s off the cuff defensive comment. I’ve no skin in the Robinson game but I don’t seek to represent those that do. When you say ‘plenty’ do you have some names or numbers or are you just bandwagon jumping?
You’ve looked at one tiny aspect of Neals performance and it’s done you no credit
You have dismally failed to engage with the arguments in my last post and are still engaging in juvenile name antics. This discussion is finished.
Liz 45
I think you either misread or misinterpreted my comment.
My point is that inappropriate behaviour of either sex usually leads to collateral damage.
All parties involved should have more sense, particularly those acting in senior governmental roles !
Liz45, your angry outpouring about sexism may have some personal justification but is a red herring in regard to Neal’s position. Any politician who has behaved as she had done would be in just as much trouble.
Parties, like any organisation, should be able to act on a ‘personnel’ mistake and replace the unsuitable choice. It happens all the time in other organisations and it should happen more often in politics.
ANy way dave, thanks for the opportunity to discuss Soph’s record more fully. I hope its been informative to other readers.
Liz, as alway, love your work,
SBH - Thank you! I agree with your points on this site.
DAVID - My so called “angry outpourings” shouldn’t be necessary in a non-sexist discriminatory world - sadly, ours isn’t one. You cleverly omit my main point, that John Della Bosca has not received the same virtuous criticisms, nor has Abbott in his crude language - it’s tolerated because after all, he’s a bloke!
Recent report re a woman’s brain during pregnancy has revealed, that the brain doesn’t undergo any changes during pregnancy, so Sophie can’t plead that? She didn’t withdraw her utterances - both should’ve apologised?
You have a convenient lapse of memory re politicians’ behaviours. I recall one Peter Reith and a mobile phone bill that allegedly cost us heaps until he was found out - he kept his job; there’s Wilson Tuckey who allegedly used his position & parliamentary letter head to intercede on his son’s behalf. Bill Heffernon and his vile lies about Justice Michael Kirby, and then there was the Labor bloke who was forced to resign years ago as he didn’t reveal a stuffed bear he’d bought on an overseas trip (I think it was called the Paddington Bear affair - Mick?Member for Melbourne Ports I think - a very decent and nice man who was once a shearer from memory)- the contrast is amazing. Bloody hypocrites all!There’s heaps more - I just don’t recall all at this time.
I wouldn’t be so critical if the Coalition led by example, but Howard let his crew get away with almost murder by comparison. Oh yes, AWB revealed yesterday that they knew over $300 million was going to Saddam, but didn’t stop it. So now that leaves the big question - what will happen to Howard/Downer etc now? How many ‘don’t knows’ ‘can’t recalls’ etc did Downer utter in his testimony at the Cole Inquiry? Over 60 forms of communication happened during this time, and they knew nothing???Right? I can see pink pigs flying over my home as we speak - and I’m going out to have tea with the fairies at the bottom of my garden!
Realist - I agree, but there should be the same morals etc for all parties and both men & women - there isn’t?