Abbott’s army powerless against climate change
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Tony Abbott will rally a “green army” to save the environment. But his anointed generals say it will be powerless in the face of climate change inaction. The Opposition leader wants to boost the numbers of the long-running Green Corps program — rebadged “Green Job Corps” by the Rudd government — to put up to 15,000 volunteers and jobless to work on tree-planting and environmental management projects. Abbott made it a centrepiece of an environmental pitch to the Sydney Institute last night. “Over the next few months … I will be talking to organisations such as Conservation Volunteers Australia and Greening Australia — the bodies that formulated and subsequently ran the original Green Corps — about the potential for a much larger and more capable national conservation corps,” Abbott said. That’s all well and good, says Greening Australia. But David Freudenberger, the group’s director of science, told Crikey “it will be a waste of time, talent and energy if it isn’t integrated with a mechanism to reduce emissions”. Freudenberger is staying out of the political debate and the merits of the government’s emissions trading scheme. But he is clear on the need for a wholesale environmental management program that includes carbon management. “A 15,000 strong environmental workforce will only be effective if it works in partnership with environmental scientists, industry and farmers to ensure land repair is resilient to climate change, provides tangible benefits to biodiversity, improves river health and supports community well being,” he says. “The challenge of both sides of government is how do we work out a mechanism so that we start paying the true cost of production. We’re not challenging the right to pollute the environment. Two centuries of environmental subsidy has to end because the environment is losing patience.” History shows direct investment by governments in the environment is inefficient in itself, Freudenberger asserts. “If you give the right signals with industry, rapid change can occur,” he says. “Fifteen thousand hard-working land repairers will be a drop in the ocean and the atmosphere without [economic reform].” In attempting to recast the environment as a “good conservative principle” for the Liberal Party in an election year, Abbott admitted Green Corps has had “intermittent attention” and “largely failed to make a difference”. But he says the Rudd government has turned the scheme into a “virtual work-for-the-dole program” and he wants it boosted to include short-term trainees. “It would be Australia’s first deployment of large numbers of people on behalf of the environment and the first time that we have approached environmental remediation with the same seriousness and level of organisation that we have brought, say, to dealing with bushfires or other local and regional emergencies,” he said last night. “A concern to protect the environment should mean much more than voting Green or joining Greenpeace. It should mean preferring those trying to do good rather than merely to look good on this issue.” But doing good, Greenpeace’s John Hepburn hits back, must go beyond “a 15,000-strong army doing battle with feral animals and noxious weeds for the sake of our planet”. He told Crikey:
Abbott revealed nothing of the coalition’s plans to reduce carbon levels, saying Rudd is obsessed with the issue and ignoring issues such as the plight of the Murray-Darling river system, which he called “Australia’s biggest environmental problem”. A coalition government will renew the “invitation” to the states to refer its power over water management of the system to the Commonwealth. The revived takeover plans have little support among irrigators, according to NSW Irrigators Council CEO Andrew Gregson. “A few simple telephone calls would have told Mr Abbott that the irrigation industry across the basin and those that rely on it oppose a federal takeover and have consistently made a case against it,” he said. |
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56 Comments
My comment just now on Cubby opinion piece in the SMH reacting to same news:
1. TA references on 7.30 last night to outdoorsy interests is recreation not conservation. So first fallacy.
2. There is nothing practical - Howard or TA - in woodchipping mature wet forests 1996 to present. Shameful, wildfire promoting landuse policy.
3. TA is seeking a reverse wedge just as Howard did on 1996 $1B Telstra sale heritage trust fund. It worked on ACF and TWS sitting on their hands back then.
4. ALP wedged back in 2007 using climate, which also worked. But now Coalition has more to play with like business friendly WWF at peak level, to offset ACF and TWS. [ALP has annexed Garrett and ACF despite protestations.]
5. Both Coalition and ALP are wrong footed by Hansen/NASA, IMF, McKibbon etc calling for a carbon tax, not cap and trade. Only Greens have the intellectual framework right so far as science bears down us all.
6. Greens and indy senators Troeth and Boyce can make glorious changes if Rudd shifts ground towards Greens for a majority vote on climate. Ironic.
7. Abbott’s green corp 1998 was always about pre empting the ‘Jabiluka express’ phenomenon where hundreds of the cream of Oz youth [bused up from SE Aust and] blocked a U mine in NT in alliance with traditional owner Yvonne Margarula. And similar forest blockades of the 90ies [which helped changed state govt in NSW in 1995].
The gambit was to harvest and re-direct youth. Cynical? Soon after Jabiluka infusion to society up there, NT state referendum defeated, ALP elected first time in 30 years in NT. Ouch. No wonder he wants a youth busy painting rocks.
Oh a couple more things after a closer read:
a. In holiday mode pollies talk about green stuff, so it has to be read down a bit, just as press run a natural history story every Monday because folks have been out and about. It’s trade work rather than sincerity as such.
b. Hepburn is right but he got active after Jabiluka above, if memory serves. Freudenberg too, though recall WWF were very pragmatic when Howard exploited their ambition in 1996 to step up into the peak level of national affairs, preface to current oil industry refugee leader now. (Head of Greening Australia (nsw?, previously national?) was ex WWF CEO in 1996.)
c. Never forget only 10% or so of farmers were card carrying members of Landcare pioneered late 80ies by National Farmers (umbrella group to state bodies) and ACF (again more umbrella than numbers?). Sincerity is very limited in our society when it comes to sustainability.
d. note similarly Rural Fires Service in NSW claims some 60K vollies but a captain said to a public meeting last year really about 15K or so! Ouch!
e. Ironic that TA is virtually parading the Turnbull agenda - irrigator efficiency in MD basin, confronting his own side of politics about the environmental policy framework. On a live blogging by TA on SDT I wrote but was omitted, “Saul, what’s it going to take for you to fight for your planet?” referencing to Paul/Damscus, but also Rural Fire Service tv adverts last month for bushfires ‘what will it take for you to fight?”.
“…Abbott revealed nothing of the coalition’s plans to reduce carbon levels…”
Did you even read his speech?
“…In the next few weeks, I will outline the Coalition’s thinking on how to foster environmental improvements that will reduce carbon dioxide emissions…”
He makes his plan pretty clear.
Should he have asked you first?
Hepburn’s Bullets and Barns approach is bogus and yet again underscores why the Green lunatics remain on the outer fringes of any debate around the environment.
Much like they are politically.
Its appropriate to mention these points from todays comments, corrections etc
Pete Wilson-Jones writes: A summary of Tony Abbott’s speech to the Sydney Institute 14 January 2009: 35 paragraphs in order of volume:
• 13 paragraphs talking about Kevin Rudd and Labor
• 10 paragraphs talking about feral weeds/animals, and how Aussies need to volunteer en-masse to wander the country cleaning it up like good Boy/Girl Scouts
• 5 paragraphs talking up the ‘little g’ Green credentials nobody knew he had
• 3 paragraphs gushing about how he will successfully resurrect Howard’s failed offer to splash $10b to take over the Murray/Darling system from the States and save it for sure
• 1 paragraph each:
- Claiming shared ownership of environmental issues with the Left
- Begging Green voters to believe him and ‘Vote 1 Abbott’ at the next election
- An end paragraph full of meaningless hyperbole….
That sums up Mr Abbott perfectly.
Lastly, I noticed TA on 7.30 biblical reference to ‘not hiding his bushell’. So is he Tony or Saul? Every year the Green Party vote trends up by 1% just as the rate of change in sea level goes up (on a J curve).
Eh? I’d have thought such a corps (and a functional mechanism to manage the Murray-Darling Basin) would be useful no matter what the climate does?
Doesn’t look like it.
It never ceases to amaze me how much consideration is given to the Coalition’s policies by Crikey (Eg currently Crikey are running five of their own pieces critical of the Coalition and not one critical of the Government - or even one about the Government). Just a quick reminder Crikey - they are in opposition. They don’t make the policies. I am yet to see an analysis of the Government’s domestic environment policies on this site. Oh, silly me, that’s because they don’t have any.
Instead of your obsessive and daily anti-Coalition rants, wouldn’t it be a little more beneficial to scrutinise the Government’s policies (or lack thereof)?
And now we see Tony Abbott,
Consistency of a myxed rabbit,
A “Green Tinted Starling”
Plying Murray and Darling -
In his “Non-core Promises” habit?
Ah John bg, perhaps there is more to criticise in the oppo ranks…Abbott provides plenty of fodder every time he opens his mouth…his most recent efforts on conservation a perfect example. He expects us to forget what a junior rat he was under head rat Howard. No chance of that. As was wisely intimated elsewhere this morning, may have been better if the defrocked one had taken a holiday as Rudder has.
Johnny B G
In case you haven’t noticed, that is the job of the opposition who are totally devoid of any real policies and have been on a spoiling campaign since the last election.
Now that it is getting closer to the next election, the mad monk is strutting around pulling non core policies out of their policy vacuum hat pretending that they had been there all along.
In the interests of good taste, can a moderator please delete Klewso’s last post? That was truly awful Klewso. Truly awful.
David,
What a ridiculous argument.
Nugget,
Indeed it is, and they should be subject to criticism when warranted. But it is the role of the Government to govern and they are not. Their “policy vacuum” and their lack of “any real policies” does not raise a whimper on these forums.
My argument is that their should be more effort on those who implement the nation’s policies and less on those whose job it is to oppose them.
“it will be a waste of time, talent and energy if it isn’t integrated with a mechanism to reduce (CO2) emissions”.
Reduction of Australian CO2 emissions, even to zero, would have no effect on AGW. Oz is too small to count. So Freudenberger’s demand is redundant. It doesn’t invalidate Abbott’s “Land Army”.
What does invalidate it is scale. 15,000 for a continent, a ravaged continent where bad practices continue? Landcare has existed for decades doing similar things (Abbott seems unaware of it). It has made a marginal difference. Exploitative ideology still rules, with some improvement.
Abbott’s Rangers would be welcome, but their good work will be undone by current incoherent land management policies/ bad agricultural practices. (The Vic Libs, for eg, want to put cattle back in Alpine national parks…)
Abbott is right to prioritise the Murray-Darling. In fact his strategy is politically smart (if environmentally unconvincing)- the pundits (not least on Crikey) who predicted a Liberal split, eternal ALP dominance etc were thinking wishfully…the Coalition belatedly realised they’d been colonised by Rudd and the climate change cult, so the feral Right revolted. Abbott is now exploiting the appalling neglect of the environment by the political Greens, who are stranded halfway to AGW Armageddon. The Copenhagen fiasco was perfectly timed for Abbott’s counter-attack.
The RuddWong Copenhagen caravan was exposed as sanctimonious hubris. No doubt the planes bringing the entourage back home were strangely quiet…114 surly suits staring at the troposphere…
Haven’t heard a thing from Keane, Rundle et al about their earlier pontifications…
JBG write this on a sticker next to your screen - “Must not ask Crikey to censor a Lefty - Lefties do not self censor”
Johnny BG
Thats like kids saying its not fair I did the washing up last night!
If the opposition wants to win goverment, the ball has been in its court since the last election,
but it hasn’t used its time constructively.
Nugget
Did you apply the same level of scrutiny when Howard was PM and Rudd was in opposition?
Gee, you don’t reckon these Liberals are trying to con their way back into government so they can bring WorkChoices back?
Geez Cuppa! Can’t pull the wool aver your ears hey?
I’d like to think so, I think Rudd is a disappointment right now.
tony does not know the difference between the eviroment protection and the clean up austrlia campaign and Global warmin
think Rudd is a disappointment right now.
HOW SO WE HAVE THE BEST ECONMOMY IN THE WORLD MORE PEOPLE IN WORK THAN ANY OTHER OECD WHAT DO YOU WANT
WORK CHOICES. come on we have never been better off than we are now
no children behind barb wire, the dogs where sent to the whafs against our own people.
rememeber weapons of mass destruction.
they where the worst 11 years of our lives.
did any one read where the irrigators are agains abbott
very interesting sorry i read it 10 min ago but cannot remember where.
My Say
I said I think Rudd is disappointing, I didn’t say I liked the last conservative government!
There is a huge difference, savvy!
JBG - Can’t argue with you mate. I voted for KRudd and quite frankly will again in November because I think Labor is probably the best of a VERY poor bunch. Abbott and his bunch of re-cycled Howard lapdogs, economic fundamentalists, bigoted religeous nutbags and other middle class no hopers or mad Bob Brown, what a choice, that’s the real tragedy.
Michael,
A vote for the Coalition is always a vote for WorkChoices.
you supporters of the refugee from the seminary are a bit down in the mouth today girls, understandable given the weak soft sexless stuff the monk has been dishing out. hang in there Barnaby is bound to get sick of zipping his yapper and start spouting nonsense again. Did you see the PM enjoying a game of cricket with the kids at the test in Tassie, there is a relaxed head of the nation. Not all tense and stone like the monk comes accross as:-)
Cuppa
And we haven’t experienced what Rudd”s new regime is going to do to small business but I can tell you off the bat it will be more expensive.
Tom
I’m with you, at the moment they are the best of a bad bunch.
David
Would be a bit happier if he was working, instead of mouthing, with or without tenseness!
Cuppa
An argument befitting Aristotle himsef. You are a bastion of intellect aren’t you mate? How about you try a little harder next time.
nugget - Isn’t Rudd allowed to take a holiday? Apparently he’s a workaholic, and I don’t recall him taking a break this long. Give him a break - he has a family too you know! You’re a long time dead!
Those who laud Howard/Costello’s so-called skills with the economy should take note of this letter in SMH July 2009-
“Before a desperate Malcolm Turnbull starts driving his new Liberal Party debt truck, he should own up about the last one.
When John Howard launched it while campaigning for election in 1996, he said nothing better symbolised the failure of Labor’s economic management than the fact that Australia “owed the rest of the world $180 billion in net foreign debt. When the Liberals lost office in 2007, Australia “owed the world” $550 billion. In 1996, the total national debt was $700 billion. By 2007 it had grown to $3.2 trillion. The Liberal Party’s real record on debt is appalling.” (Phil Teece)
This was a surprise to me too!
I also remember an article where it showed, that Peter Costello took about 18 months to reply to a question in the Parliament on increased taxes, fees and charges. It showed, that although he decleared that his govt wouldn’t do it, the Howard govt had increased/introduced more taxes, fees and charges than any other - there were about 30 from memory. I think this was prior to either the 1998 or 2001 election - I can’t find the damned piece of paper!
So each time I hear a journalist or anyone lauding the past govt, I want to scream! It’s all smoke and mirrors and BS. What’s worse, is that almost 12 yrs of neglect re infrastructure, public transport, renewable energy sources etc suffered under Howard - he was too busy handing out the goodies to the rich; and the mining companies etc at our expense. He & Costello changed the laws on super and tax which meant they’d receive an extra $2 million between them after they retired. ASIO’s budget, plus Defence has also done very nicely, thank you, out of Rudd too! Sickening!
Incidently, are millionaires still receiving Family Benefit payments; and has anyone taken a look at the figures for the wealthiest private schools - (SMH articles?) Obscene, while public education is struggling for essentials, like books and in some cases, decent toilets! Rudd is keeping to the old table until 2012???
Nugget,
So you’re a WorkChoices fan, I take it. I mean, if you’re a Liberal supporter, that’s what you vote for. Because that’s what they stand for. Ripping off your neighbours, women workers in your family, your grandkids. Paving the way for Third World conditions for coming generations of Australian employees.
Johnny B Good,
You too. Run along and explain to your grandkids and womenfolk why you willfully support the party with the agenda to make virtual farm animals of them.
@Cuppa, what a load of immature tosh although I admire your attempts for trying to hijak an environmental debate and turn it into an industrial relations debate. It is the same hollow argument of “a vote for Labor is a vote for high interest rates…”.
David Freudenberger presumably told ‘Crikey’ breathlessly that “it will be a waste of time, talent and energy if it isn’t integrated with a mechanism to reduce emissions” which is clearly a load of meaningless tosh unless that mechanism is global.
However Crikey quickly reassures us that “Freudenberger is staying out of the political debate” which is a good thing as he is clearly a clown.
Subsidies of anything never work because
(a) they are too diffuse
(b) they become the rasion d’etre rather a means to an end
(c) admin cost is too high see (a).
The simplest way to discourage something is to charge the true cost of the activity, abuse, practice. Whether land clearing, industrial pollution, providing megacities with clean water from hundreds of kms distance or whatever.
Just because it is a proclaimed maxim of the Rabid Right (which it has never followed in real life) doesn’t mean it is wrong. However tainted by association.
When even Sen Heffernan advocates not clearing marginal land, as with the alleged hunger striker recently, ya gotta wonder why his ‘colleagues’ can’t see it.
The Duke, 15 January 2010 at 9:05 pm,
Ask yourself why the Liberals are running this red herring about the environment. The ENVIRONMENT ffs! Have you ever heard anyting so ridiculous?
The Liberals & the environment … this is falling-about-on-the-floor-stuff. They care as much about the environment as they do about workers’ rights.
The only reason they’re running this red herring about the environment - blabbing on about something they couldn’t give A STUFF about - is to try to con their way back into power so they can resume their WorkChoices agenda.
And your analogy about Labor and higher interest rates fails on at least three counts:
1) At no time have Labor ever legislated for “higher interest rates” as the Liberals did (and would do again) with the so-called WorkChoices.
2) The highest interest rate ever was under a Liberal government, with John Howard as Treasurer. 21.4% in April 1982.
http://www.themonthly.com.au/tm/node/676?gclid=CPGt1pnwnJECFQQbegodmyvUuQ
3) Interest rates under the Rudd government have been historically LOW - the lowest in 40 years
http://www.theage.com.au/national/rates-at-lowest-level-in-40-years-20090203-7wus.html
Just finally, on SerfChoices. Sydney Morning Herald, 14 December 2009:
“Ask him [Tony Abbott] about WorkChoices, for instance, and he says the name is dead but the policies it represented still have merit.”
http://www.smh.com.au/business/scare-campaign-a-chance-for-rudd-to-come-clean-20091213-kqje.html
There you have it. Only the NAME WorkChoices is dead. The desire within the Liberals to re-inflict the “policy” on your womenfolk and grandkids will never die. It’s in the Liberal DNA.
It’s exactly what you vote for if you vote for the Liberals.
Don’t be sent astray by the environment red herring. A vote for the Liberals is and always will be a vote for SerfChoices.
Liz 45
No, I don’t begrudge him a holiday. Hasn’t he just been in Copenhagen?
I believe it should be an honour and a privelege to serve this country as Prime Minister and hey, you are also a long time in opposition .
Cuppa
No I am not a Liberal supporter but you are on your way to converting me.
Nugget:
“No I am not a Liberal supporter but you are on your way to converting me.”
How? By reminding you that a vote for the Liberals is a vote for SerfChoices?
And by the way cuppa, how are you going to stop Australian industry collapsing or going offshore because all of the lowest paid workers think they are entitled to a kings’ ransome?
How are you going to stop the whole economy imploding with a WorkChoices low-wage agenda?
When you cut workers’ pay and make them easier to sack (WorkChoices), you reduce consumer spending power ~and~ the confidence to spend.
It has the opposite effect of economic stimulus (which gives consumers more confidence and spending power).
This directly harms small and big businesses, as the bulk of consumption in the domestic economy is made by families working for wages.
Business in turn is forced to shed workers, driving unemployment up.
And so it goes. Wages going down, consumer confidence going down, consumption going down, business profits going down, business confidence going down, unemployment going up … and the economy spirals inwards and downwards.
Before you know it you’ve got a Third World sweatshop economy. Low wages, a virtual slave workforce, massive and growing unemployment, a shattered consumer sector, and a few greedy entities snubbing their noses at you from above.
Oh ! That explains why telstra already outsources to India, it is all clear now?
@ Cuppa, the only reference you have for your ridiculous statements is a record unemployment rate of 4.8% (or whatever it was..!) and a booming economy… I still cannot see the connection between Workchoices, which is yesterdays news, and the environment?
The Duke, WorkChoices had only been in a couple of years when we got rid of the Liberals. It hadn’t had time to work its “magic” on the economy.
Give it time, though, and you will see the scenario unfold as I outlined in my previous message. Wages down, job security down, consumer confidence down, consumption down, profits down, business confidence down, unemployment up. … Wages down, consumption down, profits down, unemployment up.
And no, SerfChoices is NOT yesterday’s news. I wrote a post to you earlier, which is still in moderation. So I won’t repeat myself, wait till Crikey approves and posts the message. Then you’ll see why indeed SerfChoices is not yesterday’s news. It’s Liberal agenda today and tomorrow, and a threat to our way of life always.
@Cuppa - was wondering what you actually think about the subject matter at the top of this blog? I have no issue with your obvious unhealthy obsession with workchoices but just as a btw, it was a policy of the Howard Government that lost the last election, it has been scrapped, it is no more, it’s shuffled of this mortal coil, it’s an ex-policy, it’s singing to the choir invisable, it’s fu%$#ng snuffed it!!!! That the Mad Monk might propose to give it CPR and revitalise it is part of the the political process. Like the rest of us, when and if it’s presented as a policy at the next election, both you and I can vote against it, this is called democracy, it is ‘the will of the people”. Endlessly banging on about it like it is the single most important issue facing mankind or civilisation in general is very very very boring indeed and proves beyond all shadow of doubt that those (workchoices, environment, gender, sexuality, race) single issue obsessives (like you) add absolutely NOTHING to the debate. Your shrill ranting is rightly ignored in a discussion covering ALL the issues we face as a kind of mild insanity. Don’t stop opposing it, vote against it but please for pity sake do it quietly in private.
NUGGET - Howard took a holiday on the north coast I believe, every year at this time. He was also a ‘well travelled’ PM by any standards - millions of dollars it cost us, staying at $1000 a head per night hotels - so! Your point is?
It wasn’t only WorstChoices which discriminated negatively for women, Howard’s tax policies did too. He turned equality for women back many yrs, and his misogynist and 50’s attitudes permeated through all his policies - spending domestic violence money on frig magnets for god’s sake!
Abbott and the environment! What a joke? I’ve never heard him make one supportive utterance for the environment ever. If we don’t attend to climate change, no amount of money will save the Barrier Reef, tourism in Tasmania, whales (increased ocean temperatures will affect krill etc to name just a few).
Abbott is a wanker on a ride to an election. Simple!
Tom,
What do I think about the subject matter at the top of the blog? The Liberals are using “the environment” (something on which they have NO credibility) as a red herring to (they hope) con their way back into power … to continue their WorkChoices agenda.
NUGGET - What’s your annual income? I’m always wary of people who gripe about workers receiving a decent income? They’re usually those who are on at least $80-100,000 per year, like right wing anti-union politicians and economists, or CEO’s on millions etc. Blue Scope Steel announces amazing bonuses for the highly paid, and bellyache at every miserly increase for its workforce; bellyaches when workers want safety standards upheld or introduced, scream poor during downturns in orders, but never backs off for the big bucks for the top blokes. Sickening!
How do you think a person on $30-40,000 provides for themselves let alone a family? Or do you just have a upper class distaste for the ‘unwashed’ living among you? From 2000 to 2006, incomes for workers went down by the same or similar amount as profits went up. How many times did Howard support a miserly $10 increase for low income workers, while taking increases to the same amount as my total income via a pension each yr? It’s the workers who provide the profits, not the bloody CEO’s?
cheers Tom, could not have said it any better…
@ Liz45 - with all due respect to your last paragraph, atleast there was not negative median wage growth as there was under Keating. I’m sure Cuppa would agree.
@Cuppa - am not going to get dragged into a pointless argument on something that ‘was’ but for my amusement and I’m sure that of more than a few others, here’s a test for you:
Draw a link between the following issues (Australian & World) to a failed policy that a majority of Australians concede was the primary reason for the change of Government at the last election (workchoices - giggle):
The earthquake in Haiti
The Snow in Europe
Osama Bin Laden
The increase/decrease in median house prices in NT and WA respectively
That horrible disease that Tassie Devils get on their faces
Krill, whales and Japan
I have $20 that says you can do it
As ‘life is what happend while you are busy doing other things’ I’m logging off now but will be back later. To claim the $20 you will have to have two others from this blog agree in principal you have met the challenge.
@Tom - I’m sure Workchoices also had an impact on our 2005 & 2009 Ashes loss to the Poms.
Tom,
Quit spinning, would ya.
I suspect you’re a Liberal trying to spin the story that WorkChoices is dead.
If you really DO believe it’s dead, you’re more gullible than the average.
To extend upon your borrowed parrot skit. The parrot isn’t bloody dead, it’s just in a cage. The Liberals would open the cage door, let the parrot out, and it’d shit all over your womenfolk and younger workers in your family.
It’d breed with other parrots, and before long the whole economy would become as bird droppings.
From the top….
Johnny B Good, do more reading:
“I am yet to see an analysis of the Government’s domestic environment policies on this site.”
Bernard Keane spent a lot of articles tearing the CPRS apart for the dog that it was.
And I’ve got nothing else to say to anyone else. Read back through this thread. The comments, from everyone, are appalling. Can’t you stay on topic for a few minutes?
i recently met a bussiness man who was saying this new work policy blb blb blaa
and I said excuse me if you where the employed what would you think ( must say he is a rusted liberal) and he said.,
Well of course if the boot was on the other foot i would feel more secure and happier in my work
now WORKCHOICES HAS GONE. i gave him a wary smile and walked away.
ENOUGH SAID
15,000 green people praying to our latest saint should fix the environment. Must be worth a try. Nothing else is working.
DUKE - So you think that having a huge gap between haves and have nots is OK? The whole point is, that successive federal govts have followed the same path - heaps for the top lot, and as little as possible for the lowest lot - those in between aren’t doing it too bad either. This is a wealthy country; it’s just the way the wealth is distributed that I disagree with.
TOM - If we stuff up on climate change, the rest will take care of itself - it will cease to be! If people think that a few people arriving by boats is a worry now, wait until hundreds of thousands are fleeing permanent destruction. The solution? Our wonderful federal politicians on the extreme right will probably set the army after them!
The mindset re WorstChoices is still in the minds of many (apart from you, of course) as they were the hardest hit by the draconian legislation and govt attitudes, including Abbott and his mates. If we forget history, it’s likely to occur!(someone said that more eloquently?). Obviously, you were unscathed by it, as were those nearest to you - I have another experience, both of personal friends and horrific stories I heard of - some still happening! Women and young people were the worst affected, and in work places where unions are allowed their stringent regard for worker safety, these workplaces have a healthier and safer work environment. Now Howard and his mates didn’t give a shit about the numbers injured at work, and the state labor govts aren’t much better! I know from personal experience. The numbers of injured youth between 16 and 25 has been horrific!
It would seem to be a charitable thing, to at least ask CUPPA what his/her experience has been? Probably has a damn good reason for being so vocal about the horrors of WorstChoices. Who knows, you might even learn something!
Democracy is not just the act of voting every 3 or 4 years - it’s the talking in the yrs in between, and demanding that govts take notice - and god forbid, do some forward planning!
Evan, we are, for once, in perfect agreement! LOL
As for the notion that Australia should not be concerned with CO2 abatement, because, hey, you know, we ‘only’ produce one percent of human emissions, is the moral equivalent of ‘let them eat cake’. So the rest of the world should act, at their cost, so that we don’t have to? (And before the usual retort: they aren’t doing anything, just note that South Korea has just passed an ETS bill. That’s one of our major trading partners, by the way.)
An argument by moral midgets who are happy to be one of the world’s greatest emitters per capita, AND happy to let the world’s poorest carry the can.
Who said imperialism was dead? This is just another version of it.
Let’s see what Abbott’s plan for emission reduction is, but judging from this underwhelming effort, nobody should hold their breath.
Liz 45
Feeling better today?
If you follow your iedeology to the end it would give us as a communist totalitarian government,
is that what u want?
Works well for the poor in China!