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	<title>Comments on: Paper&#8217;s terror edition on streets before raids</title>
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	<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/</link>
	<description>now with extra source</description>
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		<title>By: Arethusa</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33514</link>
		<dc:creator>Arethusa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 13:22:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33514</guid>
		<description>The 1st defensive Oz story stringently denies publishing the leak in the 1st edition, only the 4th:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,,25884431-7582,00.html

Now we have a second defence which makes no mention of editions or timing but harps on the point that &#039;no-one was endangered&#039; based on some apparent face saving memo from the AFP:

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25887710-7582,00.html

I was going to be a bit cynical of Crikey&#039;s vox pop anecdotes from newsagent employees, but the following comment in the second Oz article diverted my limited attention span somewhat:

&quot;At no time was anyone from The Australian told of the exact timing of the raids conducted in Melbourne early on Tuesday morning. &quot;

So in the space of 24 hrs the fabled 4th edition has morphed into &quot;the day in question&quot;. Wow. The only surprise is that the 1st article is still online for comparison without having to dig into Google&#039;s cache.

Someone please acquire the truth out of one of the print press operators, using the same interrogation methods implictly condoned by the Murdoch press in its worship of Howard and his allies, before both became too unpalatable to support publicly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The 1st defensive Oz story stringently denies publishing the leak in the 1st edition, only the 4th:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,,25884431-7582,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,,25884431-7582,00.html</a></p>
<p>Now we have a second defence which makes no mention of editions or timing but harps on the point that &#8216;no-one was endangered&#8217; based on some apparent face saving memo from the AFP:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25887710-7582,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25887710-7582,00.html</a></p>
<p>I was going to be a bit cynical of Crikey&#8217;s vox pop anecdotes from newsagent employees, but the following comment in the second Oz article diverted my limited attention span somewhat:</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>At no time was anyone from The Australian told of the exact timing of the raids conducted in Melbourne early on Tuesday morning. &#8220;</p>
<p>So in the space of 24 hrs the fabled 4th edition has morphed into &#8220;the day in question&#8221;. Wow. The only surprise is that the 1st article is still online for comparison without having to dig into Google&#8217;s cache.</p>
<p>Someone please acquire the truth out of one of the print press operators, using the same interrogation methods implictly condoned by the Murdoch press in its worship of Howard and his allies, before both became too unpalatable to support publicly.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Milroy</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33511</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Milroy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 12:59:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33511</guid>
		<description>This story and this debate really winds me up.  I was born and brought up in Belfast, Northern Ireland, and now live in Sydney.  When crazies like thses plan terrorist attacks, they usually fail; and more to the point, the civilian population quickly becomes used to it.  

Lets look at the facts.  A group of crazy Somalis based in Melbourne planned to take up arms and &quot;storm&quot; an Australian army base in Sydney.  Just repeat that sentence to yourself again.  How far would they have got, had their &quot;terrorist plot&quot; actually got past the starting post?  

Good on the police for stopping these nutters in their tracks, but lets not be scared of people like this.  I think the army is probably quite capable of defending themselves against a group of raggle-taggle loonies with a few guns.  Or at least I hope they are.  

This should NOT be front page news!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This story and this debate really winds me up.  I was born and brought up in Belfast, Northern Ireland, and now live in Sydney.  When crazies like thses plan terrorist attacks, they usually fail; and more to the point, the civilian population quickly becomes used to it.  </p>
<p>Lets look at the facts.  A group of crazy Somalis based in Melbourne planned to take up arms and &#8220;storm&#8221; an Australian army base in Sydney.  Just repeat that sentence to yourself again.  How far would they have got, had their &#8220;terrorist plot&#8221; actually got past the starting post?  </p>
<p>Good on the police for stopping these nutters in their tracks, but lets not be scared of people like this.  I think the army is probably quite capable of defending themselves against a group of raggle-taggle loonies with a few guns.  Or at least I hope they are.  </p>
<p>This should NOT be front page news!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Slyman</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33508</link>
		<dc:creator>Slyman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 12:53:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33508</guid>
		<description>It is interesting to see that The Australian are now busily defending themselves and have become &#039;the story&#039;.

As a bunch of journos they should have known very well that in this situation once they started trying to justify their position they automatically looked like they new they were guilty and were just trying to save face.

They should have played the straight bat (even if it wasnt the &#039;right&#039; answer), &#039;we believed this was a story in the public interest and therefore published it&#039;. Not get into a public argument with the police.

Instead by playing the &#039;he said, she said&#039; game (ie we were given permission to publish it by police and it didnt hit the streets until 4am; the polise say it hit the street before then and could have warned the terrorists) they are now seen as trying to wriggle their way out of a guilty situation.

The police in this situation were always going to be seen as the good guys (they wanted to protect their staff and make sure the &#039;terrorists&#039; weren&#039;t warned) and The Australian as the bad guys, no matter what or how they replied. Why make yourself look like you are a school kid who knows they did something wrong while making excuses to the teacher for something you know you arent gonna get away with. Just accept the detention with a bit of dignity and get it over and done with, at least you may be seen as having some integrity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is interesting to see that The Australian are now busily defending themselves and have become &#8216;the story&#8217;.</p>
<p>As a bunch of journos they should have known very well that in this situation once they started trying to justify their position they automatically looked like they new they were guilty and were just trying to save face.</p>
<p>They should have played the straight bat (even if it wasnt the &#8216;right&#8217; answer), &#8216;we believed this was a story in the public interest and therefore published it&#8217;. Not get into a public argument with the police.</p>
<p>Instead by playing the &#8216;he said, she said&#8217; game (ie we were given permission to publish it by police and it didnt hit the streets until 4am; the polise say it hit the street before then and could have warned the terrorists) they are now seen as trying to wriggle their way out of a guilty situation.</p>
<p>The police in this situation were always going to be seen as the good guys (they wanted to protect their staff and make sure the &#8216;terrorists&#8217; weren&#8217;t warned) and The Australian as the bad guys, no matter what or how they replied. Why make yourself look like you are a school kid who knows they did something wrong while making excuses to the teacher for something you know you arent gonna get away with. Just accept the detention with a bit of dignity and get it over and done with, at least you may be seen as having some integrity.</p>
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		<title>By: jassi</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33500</link>
		<dc:creator>jassi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 12:00:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33500</guid>
		<description>Andrew, thank you for the great article and insightful wrap up. 

I thought there were some interesting and pertinent examinations of Chris Mitchell&#039;s apparently unqualified counter-claims from the Australian-based Muslimvillage.com media forum yesterday:

http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&amp;showtopic=53590&amp;view=findpost&amp;p=836809

http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&amp;showtopic=53590&amp;view=findpost&amp;p=836816

cheers,</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Andrew, thank you for the great article and insightful wrap up. </p>
<p>I thought there were some interesting and pertinent examinations of Chris Mitchell&#8217;s apparently unqualified counter-claims from the Australian-based Muslimvillage.com media forum yesterday:</p>
<p><a href="http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&#038;showtopic=53590&#038;view=findpost&#038;p=836809" rel="nofollow">http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&#038;showtopic=53590&#038;view=findpost&#038;p=836809</a></p>
<p><a href="http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&#038;showtopic=53590&#038;view=findpost&#038;p=836816" rel="nofollow">http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?s=&#038;showtopic=53590&#038;view=findpost&#038;p=836816</a></p>
<p>cheers,</p>
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		<title>By: jassi</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33499</link>
		<dc:creator>jassi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 11:46:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33499</guid>
		<description>AFP probes &#039;terror raid&#039; leak to paper

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/846201/nixon-questions-afp-silence-on-leak</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>AFP probes &#8216;terror raid&#8217; leak to paper</p>
<p><a href="http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/846201/nixon-questions-afp-silence-on-leak" rel="nofollow">http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/846201/nixon-questions-afp-silence-on-leak</a></p>
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		<title>By: Tom McLoughlin</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33466</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom McLoughlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 08:19:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33466</guid>
		<description>As I was saying yesterday in Sydney the later editions arrived at Sydney Media Monitors in Surrey Hills/south CBD around 5 or 6 am, late in the night shift. This was 1999-2001. They would be the last news stories into the myriad pigeonholes then couriered to the wheels of institutional power - govt, corporations, big media, that kind of thing.

But mainly it reminds me also of the image of a burnt out car in Sydney, which John Howard was accused by ... the Sydney Daily Telegraph no less .... of causing with consequent loss of forensic evidence .... by tipping off the alleged terrorist arrestees with a premature presser embracing the nationalistic/war on everything tub thump. 

It was about then I thought gee this PM is a real chance to skid on banana peel this federal election 2007: Suffice to say the SDT is not the GLW yet they were putting the slipper into Mr Khaki Pants. Quite counter intuitive at the time. I made sure to keep a download of the image.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I was saying yesterday in Sydney the later editions arrived at Sydney Media Monitors in Surrey Hills/south CBD around 5 or 6 am, late in the night shift. This was 1999-2001. They would be the last news stories into the myriad pigeonholes then couriered to the wheels of institutional power - govt, corporations, big media, that kind of thing.</p>
<p>But mainly it reminds me also of the image of a burnt out car in Sydney, which John Howard was accused by &#8230; the Sydney Daily Telegraph no less &#8230;. of causing with consequent loss of forensic evidence &#8230;. by tipping off the alleged terrorist arrestees with a premature presser embracing the nationalistic/war on everything tub thump. </p>
<p>It was about then I thought gee this PM is a real chance to skid on banana peel this federal election 2007: Suffice to say the SDT is not the GLW yet they were putting the slipper into Mr Khaki Pants. Quite counter intuitive at the time. I made sure to keep a download of the image.</p>
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		<title>By: bernardz@possolutions.com.au</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33460</link>
		<dc:creator>bernardz@possolutions.com.au</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 08:04:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33460</guid>
		<description>Let me explain some questions.

The problem was in the fourth edition of the Australian. Many newsagents often do not read the Australian so many would not know. Those that do probably read an earlier edition. 

Also many newsagents have little idea of the edition of the Australia that gets sold  unless it is recorded on their particular computer system. It is not necessary as all they need to record is the overall numbers of each edition that gets sold.

Many newsagents also often hire managers for the early mornings so they could not know what was sold that morning. 

Stolen newspapers from a bundle left in front of a shop is unfortunately a common problem. 

Another point is that many people pick up newspapers on account.  So many of these newsagencies this edition might have been picked up by customers on account and if so, they would not be recorded as a sale as such. 

Having said all that I think it is very unlikely that the story was leaked, as it was only the fourth edition that had the story and it came out too late.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me explain some questions.</p>
<p>The problem was in the fourth edition of the Australian. Many newsagents often do not read the Australian so many would not know. Those that do probably read an earlier edition. </p>
<p>Also many newsagents have little idea of the edition of the Australia that gets sold  unless it is recorded on their particular computer system. It is not necessary as all they need to record is the overall numbers of each edition that gets sold.</p>
<p>Many newsagents also often hire managers for the early mornings so they could not know what was sold that morning. </p>
<p>Stolen newspapers from a bundle left in front of a shop is unfortunately a common problem. </p>
<p>Another point is that many people pick up newspapers on account.  So many of these newsagencies this edition might have been picked up by customers on account and if so, they would not be recorded as a sale as such. </p>
<p>Having said all that I think it is very unlikely that the story was leaked, as it was only the fourth edition that had the story and it came out too late.</p>
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		<title>By: AR</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33453</link>
		<dc:creator>AR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 07:38:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33453</guid>
		<description>The leaker in the security apparat was leaked upon. Wotta surprise.  It was clearly well prepped coverage,  long in gestation, so for the spooks to claim to be affronted is absurd. Sup with the Devil, use a long spoon.
As for which edition was available, when &amp; where, no-one in the Blue Mountain or points west ever SEES a 2nd edition of the Oz or SMH (no loss usually).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The leaker in the security apparat was leaked upon. Wotta surprise.  It was clearly well prepped coverage,  long in gestation, so for the spooks to claim to be affronted is absurd. Sup with the Devil, use a long spoon.<br />
As for which edition was available, when &amp; where, no-one in the Blue Mountain or points west ever SEES a 2nd edition of the Oz or SMH (no loss usually).</p>
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		<title>By: Most Peculiar Mama</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33439</link>
		<dc:creator>Most Peculiar Mama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 06:55:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33439</guid>
		<description>“…This means that literally thousands of copies, with details of the impending operation…”

Hardly.

You pepper your ‘report’ with vague recollections of possible sales from the vague recollections of select early risers...none of which can recall with any clarity the story you push as truth.

How come none of the proprietors failed to notice only the BIGGEST STORY OF THE WEEK writ large on the front page of the only daily nationwide newspaper?

What was on the poster that went into the footpath cage?

&quot;...According to the manager, customers at that time of the morning usually include taxi drivers from the northern suburbs...&quot;

So what.  Did they buy any newspapers?

&quot;...Newsagents say that thefts are not uncommon. ..&quot;

How many?  Where?  Of what?  Pron magazines?

&quot;...anyone could have purchased a copy...&quot;

Did they?

&quot;...He predicted...&quot;

&quot;...The owner..believes...&quot;

&quot;...The manager..could not recall selling any copies...&quot;

In avoiding the sweeping generalisations and conjecture on this free kick at Rupert there are ZERO facts from any of these &#039;sources&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“…This means that literally thousands of copies, with details of the impending operation…”</p>
<p>Hardly.</p>
<p>You pepper your ‘report’ with vague recollections of possible sales from the vague recollections of select early risers&#8230;none of which can recall with any clarity the story you push as truth.</p>
<p>How come none of the proprietors failed to notice only the BIGGEST STORY OF THE WEEK writ large on the front page of the only daily nationwide newspaper?</p>
<p>What was on the poster that went into the footpath cage?</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;According to the manager, customers at that time of the morning usually include taxi drivers from the northern suburbs&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>So what.  Did they buy any newspapers?</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;Newsagents say that thefts are not uncommon. ..&#8221;</p>
<p>How many?  Where?  Of what?  Pron magazines?</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;anyone could have purchased a copy&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Did they?</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;He predicted&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;The owner..believes&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;The manager..could not recall selling any copies&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>In avoiding the sweeping generalisations and conjecture on this free kick at Rupert there are ZERO facts from any of these &#8216;sources&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Most Peculiar Mama</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33435</link>
		<dc:creator>Most Peculiar Mama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 06:45:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33435</guid>
		<description>&quot;...This means that literally thousands of copies, with details of the impending operation...&quot;

Hardly.

You pepper your &#039;report&#039; with vague recollections of possible sales from 

How come none of the proprietors failed to notice only the BIGGEST STORY OF THE WEEK writ large on the front pa</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>&#8230;This means that literally thousands of copies, with details of the impending operation&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Hardly.</p>
<p>You pepper your &#8216;report&#8217; with vague recollections of possible sales from </p>
<p>How come none of the proprietors failed to notice only the BIGGEST STORY OF THE WEEK writ large on the front pa</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Wilson</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33431</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 06:39:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33431</guid>
		<description>It is my cynical belief that this whole charade was planned many months ago as a shelf exercise to be pulled out at the appropriate time. The article that appeared in the early hours of the other morning struck me immediately as a well prepared piece which had been fed through to the paper some time ago. It boasted excellent in depth background research primed and ready for the day it would be needed. I would be surprised if anybody is found guilty of anything other than being really p*%$$ed off that Australians might be bombing innocent Arab civilians in far away countries that have nothing to do with us but again I could be wrong .  

Remember that terrorist raid in the UK a few months back. Well what the papers didn’t spend a whole lot of time telling you was as far as I know that there were no charges laid and all were released. But the highly charged promotional piece got everyone sensitized to the terror bogey again.  They (whomever they are), are of the mind that in order to ensure we the people don&#039;t discover what&#039;s really going on, we all need to be constantly afraid of everything purposely driven through our &quot;neutral&quot; media. 

 If I were the controlled media, I would be spending more time worrying about the fact that nobody any longer believes what they say and can&#039;t see the point in newspapers any way. Take that that vaccines crap promoted by The Who with their masters the drug companies advocating mandatory vaccination in all of the 190 odd countries who signed up to the vaccinate for dollars scam. Has anyone done any research on the long term damage these untested vaccines might be doing to our natural immune systems? Or the toxicity of thimerosol used as a stabiliser or any of the other nasties that these things seem to contain? Or are we going to run on trust again? I mean how many times do you press the bar and get an electric shock before you work out that isn&#039;t such a good idea! Well on a partial reinforcement schedule such that we poor bunnies are fed it could be a very long time!  If you look up the controlling shareholdings in CSL you will understand why we need to be every bit as concerned here as the food folk of Baxterica or the Aventis Union.

Last time there was a swine flu outbreak in the US, 1976,  the Govt launched a massive “vaccinate or die” campaign. Only one person died of the flu but 25 died of complications with the vaccine, not to mention the thousands who suffered serious side effects namely the very nasty Guillain Barre syndrome.  So the US Govt had to can the vaccine and the program. Taxpayers picked up the tab as usual I guess. Now it&#039;s time to have another go. Look out for the second wave followed by a big third wave at the bottom of the market crash.

And now we have the terrorism crap and soon we will have the collapsing US stockmarket crap again. I just hope people are finally seeing this for what it really is.
But then, I have already told you that I am a cynic..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is my cynical belief that this whole charade was planned many months ago as a shelf exercise to be pulled out at the appropriate time. The article that appeared in the early hours of the other morning struck me immediately as a well prepared piece which had been fed through to the paper some time ago. It boasted excellent in depth background research primed and ready for the day it would be needed. I would be surprised if anybody is found guilty of anything other than being really p*%$$ed off that Australians might be bombing innocent Arab civilians in far away countries that have nothing to do with us but again I could be wrong .  </p>
<p>Remember that terrorist raid in the UK a few months back. Well what the papers didn’t spend a whole lot of time telling you was as far as I know that there were no charges laid and all were released. But the highly charged promotional piece got everyone sensitized to the terror bogey again.  They (whomever they are), are of the mind that in order to ensure we the people don&#8217;t discover what&#8217;s really going on, we all need to be constantly afraid of everything purposely driven through our &#8220;neutral&#8221; media. </p>
<p> If I were the controlled media, I would be spending more time worrying about the fact that nobody any longer believes what they say and can&#8217;t see the point in newspapers any way. Take that that vaccines crap promoted by The Who with their masters the drug companies advocating mandatory vaccination in all of the 190 odd countries who signed up to the vaccinate for dollars scam. Has anyone done any research on the long term damage these untested vaccines might be doing to our natural immune systems? Or the toxicity of thimerosol used as a stabiliser or any of the other nasties that these things seem to contain? Or are we going to run on trust again? I mean how many times do you press the bar and get an electric shock before you work out that isn&#8217;t such a good idea! Well on a partial reinforcement schedule such that we poor bunnies are fed it could be a very long time!  If you look up the controlling shareholdings in CSL you will understand why we need to be every bit as concerned here as the food folk of Baxterica or the Aventis Union.</p>
<p>Last time there was a swine flu outbreak in the US, 1976,  the Govt launched a massive “vaccinate or die” campaign. Only one person died of the flu but 25 died of complications with the vaccine, not to mention the thousands who suffered serious side effects namely the very nasty Guillain Barre syndrome.  So the US Govt had to can the vaccine and the program. Taxpayers picked up the tab as usual I guess. Now it&#8217;s time to have another go. Look out for the second wave followed by a big third wave at the bottom of the market crash.</p>
<p>And now we have the terrorism crap and soon we will have the collapsing US stockmarket crap again. I just hope people are finally seeing this for what it really is.<br />
But then, I have already told you that I am a cynic..</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Campbell</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33425</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Campbell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 06:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33425</guid>
		<description>Simply because the accused had allegedly planned their attack on an army base does not disqualify the terror-related characteristics of the would-be plot. For one, targets would presumably have been indentified on-site, during the attack, without heed for said targets positions or connections to the ADF. Secondly, perimeter security at military establishments in Australia is routinely sub-contracted to private security firms - firms who employ civilian guards to secure their sites.

There will often exist scope to differentiate between actions involving genuine terroristic intent and those of a separate, paramilitary nature. This case, however, appears to involve simple planning methodologies with limited means for enacting any conspiracy.

Arrive. Enter. Aim. Shoot. Die. Simple.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Simply because the accused had allegedly planned their attack on an army base does not disqualify the terror-related characteristics of the would-be plot. For one, targets would presumably have been indentified on-site, during the attack, without heed for said targets positions or connections to the ADF. Secondly, perimeter security at military establishments in Australia is routinely sub-contracted to private security firms - firms who employ civilian guards to secure their sites.</p>
<p>There will often exist scope to differentiate between actions involving genuine terroristic intent and those of a separate, paramilitary nature. This case, however, appears to involve simple planning methodologies with limited means for enacting any conspiracy.</p>
<p>Arrive. Enter. Aim. Shoot. Die. Simple.</p>
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		<title>By: David Coady</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33370</link>
		<dc:creator>David Coady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 04:14:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33370</guid>
		<description>A terrorist attack is by definition an attack on civilians. Whatever else it is, an attack on an army base is not a terrorist attack.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A terrorist attack is by definition an attack on civilians. Whatever else it is, an attack on an army base is not a terrorist attack.</p>
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		<title>By: brendan ford</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33362</link>
		<dc:creator>brendan ford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 04:10:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33362</guid>
		<description>This is just a fraudulent excercise by the A.F.P with little supporting evidence to maintain the huge amount of money howard pumped in to them before he left......hope Rudd doesn&#039;t fall for it though i fear he will!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is just a fraudulent excercise by the A.F.P with little supporting evidence to maintain the huge amount of money howard pumped in to them before he left&#8230;&#8230;hope Rudd doesn&#8217;t fall for it though i fear he will!</p>
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		<title>By: michael james</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33355</link>
		<dc:creator>michael james</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 03:55:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33355</guid>
		<description>The Australian&#039;s editor has apparently stated that the first three editions of the Australian carried the Gretch story, with the terrorism story not carried until the fourth edition was printed.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,28124,25886467-7582,00.html

Believe it or not.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Australian&#8217;s editor has apparently stated that the first three editions of the Australian carried the Gretch story, with the terrorism story not carried until the fourth edition was printed.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,28124,25886467-7582,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/business/story/0,28124,25886467-7582,00.html</a></p>
<p>Believe it or not.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Hawkins</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33348</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Hawkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 03:47:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33348</guid>
		<description>Apologies Andrew - you article covered the point I wanted to make. I&#039;ll read before I post in future.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apologies Andrew - you article covered the point I wanted to make. I&#8217;ll read before I post in future.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Hawkins</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33346</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Hawkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 03:45:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33346</guid>
		<description>I understand that at lesat one of the accussed drives a taxi. There are plenty of taxi drivers on the roads at 1.30 am. The taxi &#039;grapevine&#039; would be a pretty effective means of communication. It&#039;s about time The Oz is brought to heel with a firm pull on the leash.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I understand that at lesat one of the accussed drives a taxi. There are plenty of taxi drivers on the roads at 1.30 am. The taxi &#8216;grapevine&#8217; would be a pretty effective means of communication. It&#8217;s about time The Oz is brought to heel with a firm pull on the leash.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph Mahon</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33342</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph Mahon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 03:40:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33342</guid>
		<description>This really should be investigated. What would have happened if the suspects had heard of the impending raids? Vital evidence destroyed or worse federal and state police walking right into an ambush! The Australian and News put self interest way before national interest!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This really should be investigated. What would have happened if the suspects had heard of the impending raids? Vital evidence destroyed or worse federal and state police walking right into an ambush! The Australian and News put self interest way before national interest!</p>
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		<title>By: Liz45</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33338</link>
		<dc:creator>Liz45</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Aug 2009 03:31:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/08/05/terror-edition-of-the-australian-was-on-the-streets-at-130am/#comment-33338</guid>
		<description>If anyone has any doubts about the integrity of the Murdoch press, then, they&#039;re either gullible, stupid or as gross as everyone involved in the Murdoch media! It gives journalism, integrity and responsibility bad names. I&#039;m just disgusted! I made a commitment in 1975, that I would never buy a Murdoch paper again - I bought a couple of copies once - the subject was the radioactive pollution from a nuclear test. That&#039;s my total! It disgusts me! Murdoch disgusts me! He&#039;s only interested in power, empire and how it will benefit him!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If anyone has any doubts about the integrity of the Murdoch press, then, they&#8217;re either gullible, stupid or as gross as everyone involved in the Murdoch media! It gives journalism, integrity and responsibility bad names. I&#8217;m just disgusted! I made a commitment in 1975, that I would never buy a Murdoch paper again - I bought a couple of copies once - the subject was the radioactive pollution from a nuclear test. That&#8217;s my total! It disgusts me! Murdoch disgusts me! He&#8217;s only interested in power, empire and how it will benefit him!</p>
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