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	<title>Comments on: Bob Brown should pay his own legal bills</title>
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		<title>By: Venise Alstergren</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28617</link>
		<dc:creator>Venise Alstergren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 05:53:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28617</guid>
		<description>Ooer Chr-st! I apologize most profoundly to The Zebras. and to Kate.
In my hyper-sensitive mode I completely misread The Zebras comment to mean.
&quot;I don&#039;t vote for Bob Brown&quot; Period.

God I can be a clown when I set my mind to it. Once again, fulsome apologies! Grovel grovel.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ooer Chr-st! I apologize most profoundly to The Zebras. and to Kate.<br />
In my hyper-sensitive mode I completely misread The Zebras comment to mean.<br />
&#8220;I don&#8217;t vote for Bob Brown&#8221; Period.</p>
<p>God I can be a clown when I set my mind to it. Once again, fulsome apologies! Grovel grovel.</p>
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		<title>By: kate case</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28589</link>
		<dc:creator>kate case</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Jun 2009 22:41:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28589</guid>
		<description>Venise, I&#039;m with you, and so was &quot;The Zebras&quot;, that&#039;s why I couldn&#039;t understand why you were getting stuck into him/her/them!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Venise, I&#8217;m with you, and so was &#8220;The Zebras&#8221;, that&#8217;s why I couldn&#8217;t understand why you were getting stuck into him/her/them!</p>
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		<title>By: Liz45</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28563</link>
		<dc:creator>Liz45</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 06:06:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28563</guid>
		<description>Greg, fancy you castigating Bob Brown, while at the same time ignoring the reality of the Tasmanian Government&#039;s attempts to screw up not only Tasmania but the planet as well. The role and importance of Gunns in the running of the govt is a disgrace. We all know, that the &#039;little people&#039; aren&#039;t meant to even succeed in achieving what the majority want, and the Courts are usually there to uphold their views and those of the small elite or really run this country.

If not for people like Bob Brown and the thousands who supported him, here and around the world, the Franklin River would be no more. I purchased goods and donated money then, and if we choose to do it again now, what damned business is it of yours? I only wish I could contribute more, and I thank those people who did. This whole sorry mess was designed to shut Bob and those who are against the destruction of Tasmania&#039;s beautiful forests. That&#039;s the reality, and Bob refused to play. 

IF you were interested in a balanced view, which you obviously aren&#039;t; and if you were interested in upholding free speech and the ordinary person&#039;s right to access the legal process, of which our taxes pay for, which you aren&#039;t; and if you upheld any individuals or groups right to protest, then this attack would&#039;ve been superfulous. I&#039;ll help support the upgrading of support against the Pulp Mill&#039;s construction, and people like you won&#039;t put me off.

What role will you play when the old forests around the country have all gone, and the planet is slowly choking in its own filth? Probably screaming the loudest about the destruction of the planet, and us apathetic lot who allowed it to happen.  Bob Brown has more integrity in his little finger than you&#039;d have in your whole body, if it was twice its size! For his tireless struggles on behalf of the future of my kids and grand kids, I thank him!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg, fancy you castigating Bob Brown, while at the same time ignoring the reality of the Tasmanian Government&#8217;s attempts to screw up not only Tasmania but the planet as well. The role and importance of Gunns in the running of the govt is a disgrace. We all know, that the &#8216;little people&#8217; aren&#8217;t meant to even succeed in achieving what the majority want, and the Courts are usually there to uphold their views and those of the small elite or really run this country.</p>
<p>If not for people like Bob Brown and the thousands who supported him, here and around the world, the Franklin River would be no more. I purchased goods and donated money then, and if we choose to do it again now, what damned business is it of yours? I only wish I could contribute more, and I thank those people who did. This whole sorry mess was designed to shut Bob and those who are against the destruction of Tasmania&#8217;s beautiful forests. That&#8217;s the reality, and Bob refused to play. </p>
<p>IF you were interested in a balanced view, which you obviously aren&#8217;t; and if you were interested in upholding free speech and the ordinary person&#8217;s right to access the legal process, of which our taxes pay for, which you aren&#8217;t; and if you upheld any individuals or groups right to protest, then this attack would&#8217;ve been superfulous. I&#8217;ll help support the upgrading of support against the Pulp Mill&#8217;s construction, and people like you won&#8217;t put me off.</p>
<p>What role will you play when the old forests around the country have all gone, and the planet is slowly choking in its own filth? Probably screaming the loudest about the destruction of the planet, and us apathetic lot who allowed it to happen.  Bob Brown has more integrity in his little finger than you&#8217;d have in your whole body, if it was twice its size! For his tireless struggles on behalf of the future of my kids and grand kids, I thank him!</p>
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		<title>By: Tom McLoughlin</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28558</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom McLoughlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Jun 2009 02:16:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28558</guid>
		<description>Just a quick point about the Otway&#039;s legal cases: Adrian Whitehead was one victim of an axe, or was it axe handle attack to the head, and won some kind of legal redress. No doubt the kind of unionist violence Gillard was talking against recently, most ironic as her ex boyfriend Michael O&#039;Connor was in charge of the logger union.

And I say this as along time member of the ASU, soft cuddly community services union.

And in East Gippsland public interest defender Tony Hastings was stuck in major legal case against illegal logging and I was gratified to be able to help him in a legal support sense, and due to his own guts and determination he won a famous legal victory. 

All on John Brumby/Bracks watch actually as wet old growth/rainforest was illegally logged.

Tony Hastings, or Tony Quoll as his artistic moniker goes, has a great website you can google anytime and there are some stories on my blogging about his case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just a quick point about the Otway&#8217;s legal cases: Adrian Whitehead was one victim of an axe, or was it axe handle attack to the head, and won some kind of legal redress. No doubt the kind of unionist violence Gillard was talking against recently, most ironic as her ex boyfriend Michael O&#8217;Connor was in charge of the logger union.</p>
<p>And I say this as along time member of the ASU, soft cuddly community services union.</p>
<p>And in East Gippsland public interest defender Tony Hastings was stuck in major legal case against illegal logging and I was gratified to be able to help him in a legal support sense, and due to his own guts and determination he won a famous legal victory. </p>
<p>All on John Brumby/Bracks watch actually as wet old growth/rainforest was illegally logged.</p>
<p>Tony Hastings, or Tony Quoll as his artistic moniker goes, has a great website you can google anytime and there are some stories on my blogging about his case.</p>
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		<title>By: Venise Alstergren</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28540</link>
		<dc:creator>Venise Alstergren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jun 2009 09:24:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28540</guid>
		<description>Sorry Kate, I get emotional about our gorgeous trees being hacked down for lavatory paper. LP gets flushed down the lavatory. Thousands of years of beauty, wildlife torn down. Ask yourself. Do you really think it&#039;s worth it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry Kate, I get emotional about our gorgeous trees being hacked down for lavatory paper. LP gets flushed down the lavatory. Thousands of years of beauty, wildlife torn down. Ask yourself. Do you really think it&#8217;s worth it?</p>
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		<title>By: John Bennetts</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28482</link>
		<dc:creator>John Bennetts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jun 2009 03:43:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28482</guid>
		<description>The score thus far:

Greg:  Nil

Bob and the rest:  Plenty.

Greg, if it is not already too late to do so, please grow up, look around you and consider the wider moral and ethical implications of your rants before launching them.

There is a whole world out there with finite resources, warm and caring people and unimaginable complexity of life forms.

Your article and your responses to criticism show neither awareness of this world nor sign of compassionate caring life even within your own skin.

Please, for your own sake, lighten up!  Take yourself less seriously and go get a few new friends.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The score thus far:</p>
<p>Greg:  Nil</p>
<p>Bob and the rest:  Plenty.</p>
<p>Greg, if it is not already too late to do so, please grow up, look around you and consider the wider moral and ethical implications of your rants before launching them.</p>
<p>There is a whole world out there with finite resources, warm and caring people and unimaginable complexity of life forms.</p>
<p>Your article and your responses to criticism show neither awareness of this world nor sign of compassionate caring life even within your own skin.</p>
<p>Please, for your own sake, lighten up!  Take yourself less seriously and go get a few new friends.</p>
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		<title>By: Barbara Boyle</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28479</link>
		<dc:creator>Barbara Boyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jun 2009 02:17:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28479</guid>
		<description>this battler very happy to juggle the budget to contribute to Bob Brown&#039;s cause. Yes, he makes far more money than we do.
But, he works so bravely and well on our behalf and, sorry, Greg, I do so admire him for walking his talk. So unusual in our nation these days.

And what a heaven sent opportunity to send a message to: 
Forestry Tas, 
David Bartlett 
and those shadowy Lennonesque and Howardly figures. 
maybe even Peter Garrett.

Irrestistible!

 There will always be shrapnel for Bob.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this battler very happy to juggle the budget to contribute to Bob Brown&#8217;s cause. Yes, he makes far more money than we do.<br />
But, he works so bravely and well on our behalf and, sorry, Greg, I do so admire him for walking his talk. So unusual in our nation these days.</p>
<p>And what a heaven sent opportunity to send a message to:<br />
Forestry Tas,<br />
David Bartlett<br />
and those shadowy Lennonesque and Howardly figures.<br />
maybe even Peter Garrett.</p>
<p>Irrestistible!</p>
<p> There will always be shrapnel for Bob.</p>
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		<title>By: The Zebras</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28469</link>
		<dc:creator>The Zebras</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 22:51:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28469</guid>
		<description>Venise - we&#039;re on the same side you eeediot! Think! Thinking is sooo important!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Venise - we&#8217;re on the same side you eeediot! Think! Thinking is sooo important!</p>
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		<title>By: kate case</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28464</link>
		<dc:creator>kate case</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 12:51:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28464</guid>
		<description>Venise, WTF?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Venise, WTF?</p>
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		<title>By: Venise Alstergren</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28463</link>
		<dc:creator>Venise Alstergren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 11:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28463</guid>
		<description>The Zebras. thank god there are a lot of Australians who are prepared to pull their heads out of their bums, look around themselves and do good for the sake of the Nation. 
I imagine you are the sort of person who tells newcomers to go back where they come from. So here&#039;s one Australian who tells you the same thing.
Run away little manwoman</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Zebras. thank god there are a lot of Australians who are prepared to pull their heads out of their bums, look around themselves and do good for the sake of the Nation.<br />
I imagine you are the sort of person who tells newcomers to go back where they come from. So here&#8217;s one Australian who tells you the same thing.<br />
Run away little manwoman</p>
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		<title>By: The Zebras</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28451</link>
		<dc:creator>The Zebras</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 06:50:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28451</guid>
		<description>&quot;Each year thousands of Australians are dragged through the indignity of legal proceedings to ensure they pay the costs of the other party, when they lose a case.&quot; Yeah but do they represent my views in the senate? Are their cases fought on my behalf as a supporter of Tasmanian forests? Am I a stakeholder in the outcome of their cases? No. I don&#039;t support Bob Brown because I feel sorry for him! I support him because he is an *extremely* effective advocate for views that I strongly hold. If some dude goes into bankruptcy because his &#039;Jim&#039;s Cleaning&#039; franchise goes to shit, I fail to see how donating money to him/her maintains representation of my political views in the senate or contributes to a sustainable future.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>Each year thousands of Australians are dragged through the indignity of legal proceedings to ensure they pay the costs of the other party, when they lose a case.&#8221; Yeah but do they represent my views in the senate? Are their cases fought on my behalf as a supporter of Tasmanian forests? Am I a stakeholder in the outcome of their cases? No. I don&#8217;t support Bob Brown because I feel sorry for him! I support him because he is an *extremely* effective advocate for views that I strongly hold. If some dude goes into bankruptcy because his &#8216;Jim&#8217;s Cleaning&#8217; franchise goes to shit, I fail to see how donating money to him/her maintains representation of my political views in the senate or contributes to a sustainable future.</p>
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		<title>By: Juliette Hughes Norwood</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28437</link>
		<dc:creator>Juliette Hughes Norwood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 06:01:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28437</guid>
		<description>... And he&#039;s made the amount. Good.

See http://www.on-trial.info/ Breaking news.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230; And he&#8217;s made the amount. Good.</p>
<p>See <a href="http://www.on-trial.info/" rel="nofollow">http://www.on-trial.info/</a> Breaking news.</p>
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		<title>By: Juliette Hughes Norwood</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28423</link>
		<dc:creator>Juliette Hughes Norwood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 04:49:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28423</guid>
		<description>Greg, what on earth is wrong with anything Bob Brown has done here? Geez Louise, he is acting for your future as well. If you don&#039;t agree with him well fine – no-one is holding a gun to try to make you contribute. In the meantime the rest of us can exercise our democratic right to contribute if we want to. 
Or, could it just be (bear with me here – I could be just a tad over-suspicious in which case ignore the rest) that you are trying to blow enough smoke to make the uninformed say &#039;no smoke without fire&#039;? Why on earth? What the hell has this decent man done to get up your nose?
Hey, Greg, it&#039;s all your own smoke; no fire here. And he is not going to be bankrupted by backroom deals and forced out of parliament by a bunch of corrupt forest-destroyers, not if I and the rest of his contributors can help it. So move on. Get over it. Get a life. Whatever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg, what on earth is wrong with anything Bob Brown has done here? Geez Louise, he is acting for your future as well. If you don&#8217;t agree with him well fine – no-one is holding a gun to try to make you contribute. In the meantime the rest of us can exercise our democratic right to contribute if we want to.<br />
Or, could it just be (bear with me here – I could be just a tad over-suspicious in which case ignore the rest) that you are trying to blow enough smoke to make the uninformed say &#8216;no smoke without fire&#8217;? Why on earth? What the hell has this decent man done to get up your nose?<br />
Hey, Greg, it&#8217;s all your own smoke; no fire here. And he is not going to be bankrupted by backroom deals and forced out of parliament by a bunch of corrupt forest-destroyers, not if I and the rest of his contributors can help it. So move on. Get over it. Get a life. Whatever.</p>
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		<title>By: Venise Alstergren</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28421</link>
		<dc:creator>Venise Alstergren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 04:46:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28421</guid>
		<description>It is all very well to seize the legal ground here-as we all know the Law is akin to writing a thesis, you can write, or arrive at anything one wants as long as there is precedent.
And ample research to prove one&#039;s point (pity Andrew Bolt couldn&#039;t do this).
All one needs is a judge-professor-to look kindly upon one&#039;s work. And within the bounds of legality and points abc.1-4990, the court finds against  Bob Brown.

Wherein lies the first real victim in these proceedings? A poor, tattered but once powerful motivator of human endeavour, one which the law has, along with everyone else in any form of power, especially corporations, thrown overboard in their obscene rush to make millions of dollars at the expense of the land.

Her name happens to be Morality. And piously falling back on the specifics of the law in order to allow the utterly immoral practice of clear-felling our precious native forests in order to be turned into pulpwood to be sent to Japan and turned into lavatory-paper which we then buy back again is an affront to all decency. To put these rolls of infamy onto our super-market shelves is the perfect illustration of how little value is placed upon our world, and that of our childrens&#039; world for the future.

I would love to see what the law had to say if these non-renewable forests of ours would be seen in a parallel case by a judge if the were the Sistine Chapel which was the issue at stake. You may notice it too is non-renewable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is all very well to seize the legal ground here-as we all know the Law is akin to writing a thesis, you can write, or arrive at anything one wants as long as there is precedent.<br />
And ample research to prove one&#8217;s point (pity Andrew Bolt couldn&#8217;t do this).<br />
All one needs is a judge-professor-to look kindly upon one&#8217;s work. And within the bounds of legality and points abc.1-4990, the court finds against  Bob Brown.</p>
<p>Wherein lies the first real victim in these proceedings? A poor, tattered but once powerful motivator of human endeavour, one which the law has, along with everyone else in any form of power, especially corporations, thrown overboard in their obscene rush to make millions of dollars at the expense of the land.</p>
<p>Her name happens to be Morality. And piously falling back on the specifics of the law in order to allow the utterly immoral practice of clear-felling our precious native forests in order to be turned into pulpwood to be sent to Japan and turned into lavatory-paper which we then buy back again is an affront to all decency. To put these rolls of infamy onto our super-market shelves is the perfect illustration of how little value is placed upon our world, and that of our childrens&#8217; world for the future.</p>
<p>I would love to see what the law had to say if these non-renewable forests of ours would be seen in a parallel case by a judge if the were the Sistine Chapel which was the issue at stake. You may notice it too is non-renewable.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Barns</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28410</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Barns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 04:10:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28410</guid>
		<description>Paul Cumming and  indeedmy colleague Bernard Keane misunderstand the impact of the amendments passed by the Howard government and the Lennon government in Tasmania after Brown won his case in the Federal Court. The impact was precisely nil.

I would refer readers to this passage from the judgment of the Full Court of the Federal Court in Brown v Forestry Tasmania, handed down on 30 November 2007:

“The amendment to cl 68 of the RFA, insofar as it relates to CAR, simply puts in clearer language what we regard as the true meaning of the original clause.”

And this:

“In our view the clarification effected by the new cl 68, which would have been unnecessary but for the erroneous decision below, does not rob the RFA of its character of a regional forest agreement as defined.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul Cumming and  indeedmy colleague Bernard Keane misunderstand the impact of the amendments passed by the Howard government and the Lennon government in Tasmania after Brown won his case in the Federal Court. The impact was precisely nil.</p>
<p>I would refer readers to this passage from the judgment of the Full Court of the Federal Court in Brown v Forestry Tasmania, handed down on 30 November 2007:</p>
<p>“The amendment to cl 68 of the RFA, insofar as it relates to CAR, simply puts in clearer language what we regard as the true meaning of the original clause.”</p>
<p>And this:</p>
<p>“In our view the clarification effected by the new cl 68, which would have been unnecessary but for the erroneous decision below, does not rob the RFA of its character of a regional forest agreement as defined.”</p>
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		<title>By: Kimberleigh Stowe</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28404</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimberleigh Stowe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 02:50:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28404</guid>
		<description>&quot;There is nothing sinister about Forestry Tasmania&quot; 

Wake up Greg.  This is truly a first rate piece of crap that you have subjected us to. Go and write something up to the Crikey standard we are used to and demand from you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><span class="dquo">&#8220;</span>There is nothing sinister about Forestry Tasmania&#8221; </p>
<p>Wake up Greg.  This is truly a first rate piece of crap that you have subjected us to. Go and write something up to the Crikey standard we are used to and demand from you.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Cumming</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28395</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Cumming</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 00:14:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28395</guid>
		<description>Greg, the cause for question for even Howard&#039;s keenest acolytes is surely whether it is ethical, legal, fair, reasonable etc to change the law in the middle of a case. Seeing as the unholy Howard/Lennon alliance saw fit to act in such a manner surely all bets are off over what is and/or isn&#039;t &#039;proper&#039; behavior for Brown in attempting to ameliorate his position.

It really doesn&#039;t matter when Bob knew about his bill - the point is he was put in this predicament by the underhand and Machiavellian machinations of Howard, and so the high moral ground you are so amusingly trying to occupy was ceded by your erstwhile leader long ago. 

Still. your hyperventilating is well worth the subscription fee.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg, the cause for question for even Howard&#8217;s keenest acolytes is surely whether it is ethical, legal, fair, reasonable etc to change the law in the middle of a case. Seeing as the unholy Howard/Lennon alliance saw fit to act in such a manner surely all bets are off over what is and/or isn&#8217;t &#8216;proper&#8217; behavior for Brown in attempting to ameliorate his position.</p>
<p>It really doesn&#8217;t matter when Bob knew about his bill - the point is he was put in this predicament by the underhand and Machiavellian machinations of Howard, and so the high moral ground you are so amusingly trying to occupy was ceded by your erstwhile leader long ago. </p>
<p>Still. your hyperventilating is well worth the subscription fee.</p>
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		<title>By: kate case</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28394</link>
		<dc:creator>kate case</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Jun 2009 00:05:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28394</guid>
		<description>Greg, he DID set up a fighting fund at the very beginning of the case - do a bit of research!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg, he DID set up a fighting fund at the very beginning of the case - do a bit of research!</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Cass</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28392</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Cass</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 22:41:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28392</guid>
		<description>“It is a good thing to follow the First Law of Holes: if you are in one, stop digging.”</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“It is a good thing to follow the First Law of Holes: if you are in one, stop digging.”</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Barns</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28390</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Barns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 20:40:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28390</guid>
		<description>One element missing in the response by Matt Francis and others is this - Brown has known about this legal bill for many months but has only now decidedly to raise funds.  Why did he not, right at the outset of the case, some years ago, ask for a fighting fund, or do so at least after the High Court refused Special Leave to Appeal?

And should politicians use their public office to raise funds for a legal action that was brought by the Party?  Brown brought this action as a private citizen as he is entitled to do, but he is now using his position as a political party leader to run a fundraising appeal for himself?

Surely, even his keenest acolytes must be able to see that there is some cause for questions here?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One element missing in the response by Matt Francis and others is this - Brown has known about this legal bill for many months but has only now decidedly to raise funds.  Why did he not, right at the outset of the case, some years ago, ask for a fighting fund, or do so at least after the High Court refused Special Leave to Appeal?</p>
<p>And should politicians use their public office to raise funds for a legal action that was brought by the Party?  Brown brought this action as a private citizen as he is entitled to do, but he is now using his position as a political party leader to run a fundraising appeal for himself?</p>
<p>Surely, even his keenest acolytes must be able to see that there is some cause for questions here?</p>
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		<title>By: RV</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28388</link>
		<dc:creator>RV</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 15:18:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28388</guid>
		<description>By the way, donate here: http://www.on-trial.info/donate.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, donate here: <a href="http://www.on-trial.info/donate.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.on-trial.info/donate.htm</a></p>
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		<title>By: zac spitzer</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28385</link>
		<dc:creator>zac spitzer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 14:41:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28385</guid>
		<description>Right wingers complaining about the influence of money on politics

Crikey must of made a packet ads  over this story, but alas, 
it&#039;s symptomatic of the overall decline of crikey of late

i fear it&#039;s lost it&#039;s edge, 

too many idiots like this and also too much academic writing</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right wingers complaining about the influence of money on politics</p>
<p>Crikey must of made a packet ads  over this story, but alas,<br />
it&#8217;s symptomatic of the overall decline of crikey of late</p>
<p>i fear it&#8217;s lost it&#8217;s edge, </p>
<p>too many idiots like this and also too much academic writing</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Francis</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28384</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Francis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 14:28:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28384</guid>
		<description>Regardless of what anyone&#039;s opinion of Bob Brown&#039;s character and might be, the arguement put forward in this article is absurd! The court case was clearly instigated because of a belief in a cause greater than the indivdual involved, so clearly anyone else supporting that cause may naturally feel they wish to help, financially or otherwise. If it was someone other than Bob Brown involved there would still be publicity and support in the community, as long as there is support for the cause.

You don&#039;t have to agree with the cause to see that this is a natural process (that happens all the time). Really, this article is just bizarre more than anything else. Very strange.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regardless of what anyone&#8217;s opinion of Bob Brown&#8217;s character and might be, the arguement put forward in this article is absurd! The court case was clearly instigated because of a belief in a cause greater than the indivdual involved, so clearly anyone else supporting that cause may naturally feel they wish to help, financially or otherwise. If it was someone other than Bob Brown involved there would still be publicity and support in the community, as long as there is support for the cause.</p>
<p>You don&#8217;t have to agree with the cause to see that this is a natural process (that happens all the time). Really, this article is just bizarre more than anything else. Very strange.</p>
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		<title>By: Simon Birrell</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28382</link>
		<dc:creator>Simon Birrell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 12:39:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28382</guid>
		<description>I mean to say, “Ironically the area where this incident occurred has since become part of the Great Otway National Park and is protect from further logging.” oops typo</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I mean to say, “Ironically the area where this incident occurred has since become part of the Great Otway National Park and is protect from further logging.” oops typo</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Gibson</title>
		<link>http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28378</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Gibson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 11:45:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.crikey.com.au/2009/06/10/bob-brown-should-pay-his-own-legal-bills/#comment-28378</guid>
		<description>Dear Greg

I&#039;m spitting chips over your article. Bob Brown is one of the very few politicians in this country who&#039;s opinions and practice measure up to the true meaning of &#039;servant of the people.&#039;  The shocking behavior of the forestry goons of Tasmania would pulp the whole place given a free hand.  &#039;Lets chop down all the trees, dam all the rivers and who gives a.&#039;  Well I do and if Bob Brown is in financial trouble because he got of his backside and went in to bat for what remains of the Tasmanian forests then he can expect my support and will get it.  Greg go plant a tree.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Greg</p>
<p>I&#8217;m spitting chips over your article. Bob Brown is one of the very few politicians in this country who&#8217;s opinions and practice measure up to the true meaning of &#8216;servant of the people.&#8217;  The shocking behavior of the forestry goons of Tasmania would pulp the whole place given a free hand.  &#8216;Lets chop down all the trees, dam all the rivers and who gives a.&#8217;  Well I do and if Bob Brown is in financial trouble because he got of his backside and went in to bat for what remains of the Tasmanian forests then he can expect my support and will get it.  Greg go plant a tree.</p>
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