Comments on: I’ll see your sunny uplands, and raise you a free market http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/ now with extra source Sun, 12 Feb 2012 06:22:59 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Kevin Herbert http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7691 Kevin Herbert Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7691 Bernard: what supplements are you taking? <br /><br />Whatever they are, they're working wonderfully.<br /><br />Being an ex Seven & ABC news hack, I keep sending your pieces of the past 48 hours to my contacts in the mainstream media...and they're not responding...I think they're dumbfounded !!!!!!! Bernard: what supplements are you taking?

Whatever they are, they’re working wonderfully.

Being an ex Seven & ABC news hack, I keep sending your pieces of the past 48 hours to my contacts in the mainstream media…and they’re not responding…I think they’re dumbfounded !!!!!!!

]]> By: Sean Reynolds http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7692 Sean Reynolds Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7692 P.S. Just when you thought the Keane Valium was working to assuage your jangled nerves about the crisis of capitalism over the last few days, gentle readers might also like to look at the Business Day index page entitled 'Nightmare on Wall St': http://www.businessday.com.au/crisis<br /><br />All the doom and gloom news that's fit to print.<br /><br />P.P.S. There are points on the political economy spectrum somewhere between US-style capitalism and the gulags that might work more smoothly... P.S. Just when you thought the Keane Valium was working to assuage your jangled nerves about the crisis of capitalism over the last few days, gentle readers might also like to look at the Business Day index page entitled ‘Nightmare on Wall St’: http://www.businessday.com.au/crisis

All the doom and gloom news that’s fit to print.

P.P.S. There are points on the political economy spectrum somewhere between US-style capitalism and the gulags that might work more smoothly…

]]> By: David M http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7693 David M Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7693 Bernard....more good work! Bernard….more good work!

]]> By: JamesK http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7694 JamesK Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7694 Bernard Keane is not belittling the crisis Sean Reynolds........especially by falsely characterising its causes.<br /><br />FM & FM lent subprime because they were directed to by Clinton and given very cheap money by way of encouragement. The bundled and on sold the mortgages .... all AAA rated because of the US government backing of FM & FM. There was no downside to the dealers and shakers only up and they cashed in and now reality has arrived and the maturity terms of these mortgages can no longer be managed. It would never have happened if it was the banks own money. It would not have happened if the SEC was doing its job. <br /><br />We do not have the same problem here because of Keating and Costello. <br /><br />That does not mean that we shall not suffer consequences. Bernard Keane is not belittling the crisis Sean Reynolds……..especially by falsely characterising its causes.

FM & FM lent subprime because they were directed to by Clinton and given very cheap money by way of encouragement. The bundled and on sold the mortgages …. all AAA rated because of the US government backing of FM & FM. There was no downside to the dealers and shakers only up and they cashed in and now reality has arrived and the maturity terms of these mortgages can no longer be managed. It would never have happened if it was the banks own money. It would not have happened if the SEC was doing its job.

We do not have the same problem here because of Keating and Costello.

That does not mean that we shall not suffer consequences.

]]> By: Sean Reynolds http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7695 Sean Reynolds Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7695 JamesK said:<br />FM & FM lent subprime because they were directed to by Clinton and given very cheap money by way of encouragement. <br /><br />Sure, I agree Clinton got his approach to housing affordability wrong by trying to produce a solution via market finance means rather than direct intervention. Direct intervention is uncapitalistic, unAmerican and doesn't help out business cronies enough.<br /><br />Apparently the regulator (SEC) doesn't do its job. ASIC is also often charged with not doing its job and being under-resourced and a toothless tiger -- witness the recent collapse of Westpoint, Fincorp and ACR, costing investors (pensioners, soon-to-be retirees) hundreds of millions of dollars by what amounts to a series of Ponzi property scams. JamesK said:
FM & FM lent subprime because they were directed to by Clinton and given very cheap money by way of encouragement.

Sure, I agree Clinton got his approach to housing affordability wrong by trying to produce a solution via market finance means rather than direct intervention. Direct intervention is uncapitalistic, unAmerican and doesn’t help out business cronies enough.

Apparently the regulator (SEC) doesn’t do its job. ASIC is also often charged with not doing its job and being under-resourced and a toothless tiger — witness the recent collapse of Westpoint, Fincorp and ACR, costing investors (pensioners, soon-to-be retirees) hundreds of millions of dollars by what amounts to a series of Ponzi property scams.

]]> By: robert http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7696 robert Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7696 re "I haven’t seen anyone seriously arguing that over-regulation was the problem on Wall St,"<br /><br />Maybe it's a reflection on my poor reading habits, but I've come across a few contributors to threads seriously arguing that too much and too complicated regulation was and is the problem. re “I haven’t seen anyone seriously arguing that over-regulation was the problem on Wall St,”

Maybe it’s a reflection on my poor reading habits, but I’ve come across a few contributors to threads seriously arguing that too much and too complicated regulation was and is the problem.

]]> By: Sean Reynolds http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7697 Sean Reynolds Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7697 Unfortunately, Bernard Keane doesn't seem to realise that world credit markets are interlinked, and one side effect of the explosion of cheap and easy credit from the US has been a doubling of house prices relative to wages in Australia within a few years. Australia still has a major social problem with overpriced housing, which may well collapse under its own weight in the same fashion as the US markets, and very soon. The Australian banks still have some billions of dollars of exposure to the failing mortgage derivatives market in the US, and Australian non-bank lenders are already going under. Michael West of The Age has been running some very honest commentary on the 4 pillars as well, e.g. see 'Crunch time for Australia's banks' - http://www.businessday.com.au/business/crunch-time-for-australias-banks-20080917-4ijg.html <br /><br />Otherwise, read all about it at the best Australian forum on the housing market at http://forum.globalhousepricecrash.com/index.php?showforum=9 - which gathers up to the minute international finance information together with local conditions and commentary. Unfortunately, Bernard Keane doesn’t seem to realise that world credit markets are interlinked, and one side effect of the explosion of cheap and easy credit from the US has been a doubling of house prices relative to wages in Australia within a few years. Australia still has a major social problem with overpriced housing, which may well collapse under its own weight in the same fashion as the US markets, and very soon. The Australian banks still have some billions of dollars of exposure to the failing mortgage derivatives market in the US, and Australian non-bank lenders are already going under. Michael West of The Age has been running some very honest commentary on the 4 pillars as well, e.g. see ‘Crunch time for Australia’s banks’ - http://www.businessday.com.au/business/crunch-time-for-australias-banks-20080917-4ijg.html

Otherwise, read all about it at the best Australian forum on the housing market at http://forum.globalhousepricecrash.com/index.php?showforum=9 - which gathers up to the minute international finance information together with local conditions and commentary.

]]> By: Tom McLoughlin http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/10/01/ill-see-your-sunny-uplands-and-raise-you-a-free-market/#comment-7698 Tom McLoughlin Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-7698 Actually, I think this may be a shallow take on the political economy dimensions. That is the financial markets in the USA are in a social and for that I mean a hugely expensive military industrial complex: Nobel prize winning presidential adviser to Clinton - Stiglitz - has been talking about the multi trillion error of the Iraq war. <br /><br />Before him John Kenneth Galbraith winner of two presidential medals of freedom argued that the MIC expanded and contracted in cycles as it predated on the domestic economy and society beyond toleration and the democracy flipped back to the doves. <br /><br />Sooo ... where were all those poor folks in their millions going to live if not for subprime loans? In the street? Sure as hell with so much money splurged on the military they weren't going to get state subsidised public housing. But the Bush GOP loyalists in the markets probably were willing to cook up a solution, especially after 9/11 which after all was 'their' people who were hit. <br /><br />And now the instability of those political economic settings has hit the wall (!) what are we looking at - an argument in Congress about exactly what Guy Rundle as referred to ...socialisation of housing assets to public ownership versus bailouts of the lenders, not the borrowers. Rundle 1 - Keane 0? Actually, I think this may be a shallow take on the political economy dimensions. That is the financial markets in the USA are in a social and for that I mean a hugely expensive military industrial complex: Nobel prize winning presidential adviser to Clinton - Stiglitz - has been talking about the multi trillion error of the Iraq war.

Before him John Kenneth Galbraith winner of two presidential medals of freedom argued that the MIC expanded and contracted in cycles as it predated on the domestic economy and society beyond toleration and the democracy flipped back to the doves.

Sooo … where were all those poor folks in their millions going to live if not for subprime loans? In the street? Sure as hell with so much money splurged on the military they weren’t going to get state subsidised public housing. But the Bush GOP loyalists in the markets probably were willing to cook up a solution, especially after 9/11 which after all was ‘their’ people who were hit.

And now the instability of those political economic settings has hit the wall (!) what are we looking at - an argument in Congress about exactly what Guy Rundle as referred to …socialisation of housing assets to public ownership versus bailouts of the lenders, not the borrowers. Rundle 1 - Keane 0?

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