Comments on: Afghan dog pen demeans us and emboldens the insurgents http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/ now with extra source Sun, 22 Nov 2009 07:04:32 +1100 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Joseph Elliott http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18826 Joseph Elliott Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18826 It could have been worse for the prisoners - the Aussies could have treated them the same way the Taliban treat their women. It could have been worse for the prisoners - the Aussies could have treated them the same way the Taliban treat their women.

]]> By: Richard L http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18827 Richard L Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18827 Disappointing from Kaysar Trad, who often makes good sense. The incident that so inflames his sensibilities took place in an operational area where Australian troops face opponents armed with lethal weaponry and few scruples about when or where or how to use them. It wasn't a stoush outside a pub on a Saturday night. There were no police paddy-wagons around in which to house detainees decorously or transport them to the watchhouse. There was no duty magistrate available to bail the suspects. Get real. We can be sure Australian forces operate with a great deal more sensitivity than many, but they are there to do a job - and if that means detaining people overnight in culturally insensitive conditions, tough sh-t. Everyone should remember all the lessons that Afghanistan has taught "invaders" over the centuries. The chief one is never trust an Afghan to abide by the rules of war. Disappointing from Kaysar Trad, who often makes good sense. The incident that so inflames his sensibilities took place in an operational area where Australian troops face opponents armed with lethal weaponry and few scruples about when or where or how to use them. It wasn’t a stoush outside a pub on a Saturday night. There were no police paddy-wagons around in which to house detainees decorously or transport them to the watchhouse. There was no duty magistrate available to bail the suspects. Get real. We can be sure Australian forces operate with a great deal more sensitivity than many, but they are there to do a job - and if that means detaining people overnight in culturally insensitive conditions, tough sh-t. Everyone should remember all the lessons that Afghanistan has taught “invaders” over the centuries. The chief one is never trust an Afghan to abide by the rules of war.

]]> By: Steve Martin http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18828 Steve Martin Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18828 Incidentally who,apart from Keysar Trad says dogs are unclean. Afghan Hounds are presumably from Afghanistan so Afghans bred them ,and use them for hunting. Doesn't sound as if the Afghan regard them as unclean. Incidentally who,apart from Keysar Trad says dogs are unclean. Afghan Hounds are presumably from Afghanistan so Afghans bred them ,and use them for hunting. Doesn’t sound as if the Afghan regard them as unclean.

]]> By: Pete http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18829 Pete Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18829 Considering that an alternate approach could have been "take no prisoners," and the SAS have a reputation for being very efficient at what they do, it could have been considerably worse for the detainees than dog cages. Considering that an alternate approach could have been “take no prisoners,” and the SAS have a reputation for being very efficient at what they do, it could have been considerably worse for the detainees than dog cages.

]]> By: JJ Goold http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18830 JJ Goold Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18830 More free propaganda given to the Taliban. However the average reader will be well aware that a kennel large enough for Afghan Hounds is comfortable enough to hold captured terrorists. And it is only against the Geneva convention if the SAS neglected to feed them Pal or Chum.<br /> More free propaganda given to the Taliban. However the average reader will be well aware that a kennel large enough for Afghan Hounds is comfortable enough to hold captured terrorists. And it is only against the Geneva convention if the SAS neglected to feed them Pal or Chum.

]]> By: Keysar Trad http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18831 Keysar Trad Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18831 I had the hyperlink about the Afghan resources in the original article but the editors removed it. Go to http://www.newhumanist.com/oil.html to get more information. <br /><br />I am really impressed with the comments on this article, obviously the minister, who had somewhat backtracked today (blaming the troops for not knowing what a dog kennel/pen is http://www.theage.com.au/national/minister-denies-taliban-held-in-dog-kennels-20080902-481h.html?page=-1) knew exactly to whom he was pandering.<br /><br />If our troops called them dog pens and used them to hold human beings, then there is a serious problem for which the minister must apologise. <br /><br />Question: When is a dog pen not a dog kennel? <br />Answer: When the minister is embarrassed into changing its label.<br /><br />Our misadventurous invasion of Afghanistan includes a number of reasons, our continued stay in there is to get a share of certain resources, just like our continued participation in Iraq. Our government also only withdrew a little over one third of our troops from Iraq leaving a thousand troops there (refer: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/06/02/australia.iraq/), so we are in both countries and we are better off remaining in neither of the two. I had the hyperlink about the Afghan resources in the original article but the editors removed it. Go to http://www.newhumanist.com/oil.html to get more information.

I am really impressed with the comments on this article, obviously the minister, who had somewhat backtracked today (blaming the troops for not knowing what a dog kennel/pen is http://www.theage.com.au/national/minister-denies-taliban-held-in-dog-kennels-20080902-481h.html?page=-1) knew exactly to whom he was pandering.

If our troops called them dog pens and used them to hold human beings, then there is a serious problem for which the minister must apologise.

Question: When is a dog pen not a dog kennel?
Answer: When the minister is embarrassed into changing its label.

Our misadventurous invasion of Afghanistan includes a number of reasons, our continued stay in there is to get a share of certain resources, just like our continued participation in Iraq. Our government also only withdrew a little over one third of our troops from Iraq leaving a thousand troops there (refer: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/06/02/australia.iraq/), so we are in both countries and we are better off remaining in neither of the two.

]]> By: Mark Duffett http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18832 Mark Duffett Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18832 Venise, I requested evidence. This is one of those funny situations when someone (i.e. me) requests information they haven't already got. Gee, how arrogant is that?<br /><br />The notion that we are in Afghanistan on a 'resource grab' is genuine news to me. It's an extraordinary claim, but I'm not even after extraordinary evidence - just any at all. Venise, I requested evidence. This is one of those funny situations when someone (i.e. me) requests information they haven’t already got. Gee, how arrogant is that?

The notion that we are in Afghanistan on a ‘resource grab’ is genuine news to me. It’s an extraordinary claim, but I’m not even after extraordinary evidence - just any at all.

]]> By: Fido http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18833 Fido Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18833 Woofwoof...........arf...woof....grrrr...wofwoof Woofwoof………..arf…woof….grrrr…wofwoof

]]> By: Nelson http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18834 Nelson Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18834 So reviewing the comments placed so far it seems clear that the consensus is; if you live in Afghanistan and get detained by our SAS you are guilty of being Taliban. So if by inference this means all Afghans are Taliban, what exactly are we doing in Afghanistan in the first place? If we hate them all so much that they deserve no rights why are we wasting tax payer’s money fighting a war against a country that hasn't attacked us and a people who don't want to adopt our values? So reviewing the comments placed so far it seems clear that the consensus is; if you live in Afghanistan and get detained by our SAS you are guilty of being Taliban. So if by inference this means all Afghans are Taliban, what exactly are we doing in Afghanistan in the first place? If we hate them all so much that they deserve no rights why are we wasting tax payer’s money fighting a war against a country that hasn’t attacked us and a people who don’t want to adopt our values?

]]> By: Mark Duffett http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18835 Mark Duffett Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18835 "We are in Afghanistan on a resource grab"? I'd support that assertion with some evidence (like 'what resources', would be a good start) very quickly, if I were you. Otherwise, say goodbye to whatever credibility you had. “We are in Afghanistan on a resource grab”? I’d support that assertion with some evidence (like ‘what resources’, would be a good start) very quickly, if I were you. Otherwise, say goodbye to whatever credibility you had.

]]> By: Venise Alstergren http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18836 Venise Alstergren Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18836 Mark Duffett,<br />I hope your information is better than your arrogance. For the past 50 years there's been more than a hint that great mineral wealth; possibly oil, will be found in Afghanistan. The rumours are far from being at just bazaar level. Not unlike the rumours that used to circulate that Australia may prove to have oil. Until the first strike at a place called Moonie in QLD. Mark Duffett,
I hope your information is better than your arrogance. For the past 50 years there’s been more than a hint that great mineral wealth; possibly oil, will be found in Afghanistan. The rumours are far from being at just bazaar level. Not unlike the rumours that used to circulate that Australia may prove to have oil. Until the first strike at a place called Moonie in QLD.

]]> By: steve martin http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18837 steve martin Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18837 Before passing judgement one way or the other more facts are needed. For example what was the alternative? This may have been the only secure building available. If this is the case the alternative might have been chains overnight. Now that would really put the cat among the pigeons.. Before passing judgement one way or the other more facts are needed. For example what was the alternative? This may have been the only secure building available. If this is the case the alternative might have been chains overnight. Now that would really put the cat among the pigeons..

]]> By: Brad http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/09/02/afghan-dog-pen-demeans-us-and-emboldens-the-insurgents/#comment-18838 Brad Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-18838 Keyser Trad - what sort of accomodation do you want our soldiers in the field to organise exactly? Perhaps you can also comment on the accomodations provided to unexpected guests by the Taliban - cat got your tounge?<br /><br /> Keyser Trad - what sort of accomodation do you want our soldiers in the field to organise exactly? Perhaps you can also comment on the accomodations provided to unexpected guests by the Taliban - cat got your tounge?

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