Comments on: How Cubbie (and Labor) consumed the Murray Darling http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/ now with extra source Sun, 12 Feb 2012 08:46:21 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: JamesK http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15630 JamesK Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15630 I know I shouldn't gossip but i think that dreadful Downer man had something to do with that Iraq thingy as well.... I know I shouldn’t gossip but i think that dreadful Downer man had something to do with that Iraq thingy as well….

]]> By: John Flynne http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15631 John Flynne Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15631 Cubbie = G(r)oss,Rudd(erless) And W(r)ong all lace(y) d up. Cubbie = G(r)oss,Rudd(erless) And W(r)ong all lace(y) d up.

]]> By: Tom McLoughlin http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15632 Tom McLoughlin Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15632 Mmm wish Beattie had got that sale plan happening. I don't believe Marilyn running interference for the ALP here either. 1981 is completely different given the systemic climate shift since then.<br /><br />What struck me too was this line from Phil Dickie "even as neighbours in the region were prevented from building far smaller dams". This rings a bell.<br /><br />Switch to Peats Ridge, Mangrove Mountain in the Gosford Local Govt area (vote Sept 13). Local landholder Margaret Pontifix (also secretary MM District Community Group Inc registered charity) applies for a modest increase in groundwater allocation in 2005. Rejected. As are any other local small time farmers. <br /><br />Roughly the same time Coca Cola apply for a 41ML increase in an already over allocated aquifer with unlicensed use by quarries (big water users actually to wash clay from sand etc) and the local water supply for Gosford/Wyong under severe restrictions. Coca Cola want to expand their bottled water plant. No worries - sales through courtesy of the State Dept 2005 under ex Minister Craig Knowles. This Dept changes acronyms like a snake changes skin - DLWC, DIPNR, DNR, now DWE. <br /><br />We are told from sources that nothing under 100ML is even assessed by DWE. They don't know the rainfall recharge rates there, they don't know the (unlicensed) water users, they don't even know how the sandstone aquifer works (more swiss cheese than bathtub). <br /><br />Coca Cola Amatil donated $2M to both major parties in the last 10 years. Today they posted their "second half profit" in "its biggest market, Australia" p21 Australian 21/8/08. Don't know if that last bit could possibly be true. But here's the thing - It's all over allocated at MM and money politics looks to control who gets the rails run. It's an utter market failure like climate change. These major party politicians can't fix the problem - they are the problem. This is close to Sydney. Imagine how much worse in remote Murray Darling? <br /><br />Now here's the kicker - The guys in the South Coast office of DWE here in NSW who waved CCA through at Peats Ridge are now apparently running the NSW component of supervision of the Murray Darling situation. They are the 'experts'. <br /><br />Conclusion: It's over. They killed the Murrary Darling.<br /> Mmm wish Beattie had got that sale plan happening. I don’t believe Marilyn running interference for the ALP here either. 1981 is completely different given the systemic climate shift since then.

What struck me too was this line from Phil Dickie “even as neighbours in the region were prevented from building far smaller dams”. This rings a bell.

Switch to Peats Ridge, Mangrove Mountain in the Gosford Local Govt area (vote Sept 13). Local landholder Margaret Pontifix (also secretary MM District Community Group Inc registered charity) applies for a modest increase in groundwater allocation in 2005. Rejected. As are any other local small time farmers.

Roughly the same time Coca Cola apply for a 41ML increase in an already over allocated aquifer with unlicensed use by quarries (big water users actually to wash clay from sand etc) and the local water supply for Gosford/Wyong under severe restrictions. Coca Cola want to expand their bottled water plant. No worries - sales through courtesy of the State Dept 2005 under ex Minister Craig Knowles. This Dept changes acronyms like a snake changes skin - DLWC, DIPNR, DNR, now DWE.

We are told from sources that nothing under 100ML is even assessed by DWE. They don’t know the rainfall recharge rates there, they don’t know the (unlicensed) water users, they don’t even know how the sandstone aquifer works (more swiss cheese than bathtub).

Coca Cola Amatil donated $2M to both major parties in the last 10 years. Today they posted their “second half profit” in “its biggest market, Australia” p21 Australian 21/8/08. Don’t know if that last bit could possibly be true. But here’s the thing - It’s all over allocated at MM and money politics looks to control who gets the rails run. It’s an utter market failure like climate change. These major party politicians can’t fix the problem - they are the problem. This is close to Sydney. Imagine how much worse in remote Murray Darling?

Now here’s the kicker - The guys in the South Coast office of DWE here in NSW who waved CCA through at Peats Ridge are now apparently running the NSW component of supervision of the Murray Darling situation. They are the ‘experts’.

Conclusion: It’s over. They killed the Murrary Darling.

]]> By: JamesK http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15633 JamesK Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15633 Yeah ....forgive me Marilyn.<br /><br />Jack has demonstrated the the blindingly obvious ( this i embarassing.....I really am at a loss as to how I failed to see it before now....still it's never too late) and I am sorry for doubting Labor......... <br /><br />That nice Mr. Rudd and the gentlemanly Mr. Brumby along with the sweet Anna Bligh and Messrs. Iemma and Rann will sit down, enjoy an nice cup of tea and quietly resolve the minor issue of the Murray-Darling just before Mr. Rudd suits up to save the planet. Yeah ….forgive me Marilyn.

Jack has demonstrated the the blindingly obvious ( this i embarassing…..I really am at a loss as to how I failed to see it before now….still it’s never too late) and I am sorry for doubting Labor………

That nice Mr. Rudd and the gentlemanly Mr. Brumby along with the sweet Anna Bligh and Messrs. Iemma and Rann will sit down, enjoy an nice cup of tea and quietly resolve the minor issue of the Murray-Darling just before Mr. Rudd suits up to save the planet.

]]> By: Chris Johnson http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15634 Chris Johnson Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15634 The Murray-Darling's certainly in its death throws but perhaps it's because both our major parties allowed someone like Leith Boully into every water resource, primary industry, agriculture and land care decision-making board, committee, group, panel and council across four states. From the Murrimbidgee to the Darling, the Brisbane and Mary Rivers her presence and influence has seemingly ensured Cubbie Station and its environs are more than well cared for. Successive primary and environment industry ministers along with Premiers, Prime and deputy-Prime Ministers from both parties opened their doors to a young sprout from the NT’s Young Country/Liberal movement. Now Cubbie, Leith and her neighbouring properties languish with water licences guaranteeing their dominance as cotton corporate and privately financed harvesters of fresh water worth well in excess of ten-million dollars. The former director of the ABC, Australian Heritage Commission and member of the Murray-Darling Basin Ministerial Council….check out the rest, has surpassed any James Bond role. Even the National’s John Anderson succumbed to a Cubbie cuddle after the station hosted a ‘thank you John” party when he reneged on supporting its sale to the Queensland Government. And still the silly State with its endless no-brainer MP’s simply sealed the nation’s fate by courting a smart, self-serving cattle and cotton farmer with a single agenda. http://www.nrsm.uq.edu.au/staff/Cvs/leith.boully.pdf Make up your own minds. The Murray-Darling’s certainly in its death throws but perhaps it’s because both our major parties allowed someone like Leith Boully into every water resource, primary industry, agriculture and land care decision-making board, committee, group, panel and council across four states. From the Murrimbidgee to the Darling, the Brisbane and Mary Rivers her presence and influence has seemingly ensured Cubbie Station and its environs are more than well cared for. Successive primary and environment industry ministers along with Premiers, Prime and deputy-Prime Ministers from both parties opened their doors to a young sprout from the NT’s Young Country/Liberal movement. Now Cubbie, Leith and her neighbouring properties languish with water licences guaranteeing their dominance as cotton corporate and privately financed harvesters of fresh water worth well in excess of ten-million dollars. The former director of the ABC, Australian Heritage Commission and member of the Murray-Darling Basin Ministerial Council….check out the rest, has surpassed any James Bond role. Even the National’s John Anderson succumbed to a Cubbie cuddle after the station hosted a ‘thank you John” party when he reneged on supporting its sale to the Queensland Government. And still the silly State with its endless no-brainer MP’s simply sealed the nation’s fate by courting a smart, self-serving cattle and cotton farmer with a single agenda. http://www.nrsm.uq.edu.au/staff/Cvs/leith.boully.pdf Make up your own minds.

]]> By: Dr Harvey M Tarvydas http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15635 Dr Harvey M Tarvydas Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15635 Very few if any labour politicians federal or state would have the courage if the wisdom to do the right thing regarding Cubbie and the Murray Darling destruction in the terms of your article outlining a seriously disempowering entanglement. Very few if any labour politicians federal or state would have the courage if the wisdom to do the right thing regarding Cubbie and the Murray Darling destruction in the terms of your article outlining a seriously disempowering entanglement.

]]> By: Dr Harvey M Tarvydas #2 http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15636 Dr Harvey M Tarvydas #2 Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15636 Marilyn, concratulations, you are a bit of an authority.<br />You're right, our obsession with 'climate corruption' (my new name for 'climate change') has led us to forget what a drought is, or become so confused we dismiss drought breaking rain. Marilyn, concratulations, you are a bit of an authority.
You’re right, our obsession with ‘climate corruption’ (my new name for ‘climate change’) has led us to forget what a drought is, or become so confused we dismiss drought breaking rain.

]]> By: Pamela http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15637 Pamela Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15637 Keep writing and stirring Bernard Keane. The time it has taken to dissect the Murray Darling murder is indicative of the power of those who cover up the crime.<br />Why buy Cubbie? <br />It should be resumed in the National interest.<br />Ressusitate the river now. Keep writing and stirring Bernard Keane. The time it has taken to dissect the Murray Darling murder is indicative of the power of those who cover up the crime.
Why buy Cubbie?
It should be resumed in the National interest.
Ressusitate the river now.

]]> By: Acacia Rose http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15638 Acacia Rose Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15638 Post the 5th World Water Forum in Istanbul the global water justice movement - and it is considerable across tens of nations including Australia - is demanding that the UN formally recognise water as a HUMAN RIGHT and that the World Water Forum come under the banner of the UN. Australia - namely Queensland and one former Goss staffer - have effectively sold off public water resources to private enterprises - notably, the French Water Lords, Suez, Veolia and in South Australia, 'United Water' a consortium of Suez and Thames or now, Macquarie Water. The water problems for Brisbane are in part as a result of the so-called 'public private partnerships' which are nothing more than a gateway to the privatisation of public water, public water utilities and in the case of Cubbie Station a virtual hand out of public water. Kevin Rudd and Penny Wong should be a little more transparent about the Queensland and South Australia water privatisation agenda and in the middle, the Murray is virtually dead. Meanwhile, the Snowy River continues to subsidise the Murray, read - water privatisation! It is time to place Australia's water resources under public management - a public trust, a totally independent water manager, free from political interference. The Snowy is virtually dead below Guthega Dam and Island Bend Pondage, virtually lifeless below Jindabyne Dam wall and the reason is just the same, selling off public water resources for water trading, 'forward borrows' and of course, so that Snowy Hydro can bump up its balance sheet including from trading in the derivatives market in order to invest more money in gas energy generation. Look out the Kimberly!<br /><br />Yes - time for a Charter of Human Rights and within that Charter, Water is listed as a HUMAN RIGHT.<br /><br />Kevin and Penny - your careers are linked to the death of our great rivers. Post the 5th World Water Forum in Istanbul the global water justice movement - and it is considerable across tens of nations including Australia - is demanding that the UN formally recognise water as a HUMAN RIGHT and that the World Water Forum come under the banner of the UN. Australia - namely Queensland and one former Goss staffer - have effectively sold off public water resources to private enterprises - notably, the French Water Lords, Suez, Veolia and in South Australia, ‘United Water’ a consortium of Suez and Thames or now, Macquarie Water. The water problems for Brisbane are in part as a result of the so-called ‘public private partnerships’ which are nothing more than a gateway to the privatisation of public water, public water utilities and in the case of Cubbie Station a virtual hand out of public water. Kevin Rudd and Penny Wong should be a little more transparent about the Queensland and South Australia water privatisation agenda and in the middle, the Murray is virtually dead. Meanwhile, the Snowy River continues to subsidise the Murray, read - water privatisation! It is time to place Australia’s water resources under public management - a public trust, a totally independent water manager, free from political interference. The Snowy is virtually dead below Guthega Dam and Island Bend Pondage, virtually lifeless below Jindabyne Dam wall and the reason is just the same, selling off public water resources for water trading, ‘forward borrows’ and of course, so that Snowy Hydro can bump up its balance sheet including from trading in the derivatives market in order to invest more money in gas energy generation. Look out the Kimberly!

Yes - time for a Charter of Human Rights and within that Charter, Water is listed as a HUMAN RIGHT.

Kevin and Penny - your careers are linked to the death of our great rivers.

]]> By: Jack http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15639 Jack Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15639 I fail to see what the problem is. We can argue about the past, but we don't need to as the solutions (and water) will surely flow in the next day or two.<br /><br />My logic is flawless. In addition to lower food & petrol prices & better housing affordability I recall the present federal government also said that cheek to jowl labor governments would lead to a glorious future of harmonious cooperation between State & Commonwealth. Murray-Darling / Cubby therefore an easy fix once the mandarins sit down and i have full faith that action will follow. All you doubters will soon see the error of your ways ! I fail to see what the problem is. We can argue about the past, but we don’t need to as the solutions (and water) will surely flow in the next day or two.

My logic is flawless. In addition to lower food & petrol prices & better housing affordability I recall the present federal government also said that cheek to jowl labor governments would lead to a glorious future of harmonious cooperation between State & Commonwealth. Murray-Darling / Cubby therefore an easy fix once the mandarins sit down and i have full faith that action will follow. All you doubters will soon see the error of your ways !

]]> By: Marilyn http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15640 Marilyn Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15640 James that is utter rot. Downer was the Howard minister in the seat of Mayo for 24 years and he said and did nothing.<br /><br />Turnbull doesn't have a clue and never did and Wong/Rudd have had 8 months of a problem that is 50 years old.<br /><br />Jesue weeping the ignorant leading the stupid here boys. James that is utter rot. Downer was the Howard minister in the seat of Mayo for 24 years and he said and did nothing.

Turnbull doesn’t have a clue and never did and Wong/Rudd have had 8 months of a problem that is 50 years old.

Jesue weeping the ignorant leading the stupid here boys.

]]> By: Eric http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15641 Eric Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15641 Isn't this just the good old Queenslandstory of money changing hands in parking lots, except now the bags are made of "environmentally friendly raw cotton instead of brown paper ?<br /><br />Releasing water from Menindee Lakes while making good press is not the answer. There has to be flow into the lakes as well. I was in Menindee nine months ago and the drowned trees you see sticking out of the water pictured in the tourist brochures were two metres above the water level.<br /><br />The answer is to charge all irrigators a true "cost plus" price for the water they draw from the system. There are much more efficient ways of irrigating than the flood method that most now use. Charging them the real value of the water would encourage the use of more efficient ways. Less water being put on the paddocks would also reduce the increasing rate of soil salinity. <br /><br />BTW, I'm not a "city greenie", for the last 30 years my time has been spent in the Macquarie, Namoi, Barwon, Darling, Lower Murray and Riverina irrigation areas and have seen how much the rivers have degraded in that time<br /><br /> Isn’t this just the good old Queenslandstory of money changing hands in parking lots, except now the bags are made of “environmentally friendly raw cotton instead of brown paper ?

Releasing water from Menindee Lakes while making good press is not the answer. There has to be flow into the lakes as well. I was in Menindee nine months ago and the drowned trees you see sticking out of the water pictured in the tourist brochures were two metres above the water level.

The answer is to charge all irrigators a true “cost plus” price for the water they draw from the system. There are much more efficient ways of irrigating than the flood method that most now use. Charging them the real value of the water would encourage the use of more efficient ways. Less water being put on the paddocks would also reduce the increasing rate of soil salinity.

BTW, I’m not a “city greenie”, for the last 30 years my time has been spent in the Macquarie, Namoi, Barwon, Darling, Lower Murray and Riverina irrigation areas and have seen how much the rivers have degraded in that time

]]> By: Cathy http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15642 Cathy Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15642 Yes Graeme...it IS a national emergency that requires Rudd to walk on hot coals and tell the Cubbie Group that it's current water management arrangements are being re-negotiated in the national interests. And if you think he's about to step outside the 'protect-at-all-costs-party-policy", you're dreaming. Yes Graeme…it IS a national emergency that requires Rudd to walk on hot coals and tell the Cubbie Group that it’s current water management arrangements are being re-negotiated in the national interests. And if you think he’s about to step outside the ‘protect-at-all-costs-party-policy”, you’re dreaming.

]]> By: Graeme Lewis http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15643 Graeme Lewis Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15643 Jack has got it all right ! Wall-to-wall Labor will fix all this by doing radical things such as are required in this matter. Hello!!<br />The river system dies a little (or maybe a lot) every day. Last week Mr Keane wanted to be "fair" to this new Federal Govt by his reporting that an audit had been commissioned. Today Mr Keane has had a Damascus-like awakening, and exposes facts that go way past an "audit." Rome is burning while Kev07 and Penny W. just fiddle.<br />It is absolutely time to forget political correctness, and not worry incessantly about the dangers of doing something that might later be adjudged wrong. It is not wrong to immediately stop wrongful use of water or selfish storage. It is not wrong to commit resources (ie money) to marshall every probable, likely or even vaguely possible solution. This is unquestionably a National Emergency, because if this system is allowed to die, it will take a lot more than a year or even a decade of good rains to restore it .<br />And playing the blame game as Marilyn et al want do helps not one iota. The country does need rain - sure - but it also needs some urgent real action to seize total control of whatever is left of this vital National resource.<br />What is so wrong with Wong and Rudd just doing something real - anything!! Jack has got it all right ! Wall-to-wall Labor will fix all this by doing radical things such as are required in this matter. Hello!!
The river system dies a little (or maybe a lot) every day. Last week Mr Keane wanted to be “fair” to this new Federal Govt by his reporting that an audit had been commissioned. Today Mr Keane has had a Damascus-like awakening, and exposes facts that go way past an “audit.” Rome is burning while Kev07 and Penny W. just fiddle.
It is absolutely time to forget political correctness, and not worry incessantly about the dangers of doing something that might later be adjudged wrong. It is not wrong to immediately stop wrongful use of water or selfish storage. It is not wrong to commit resources (ie money) to marshall every probable, likely or even vaguely possible solution. This is unquestionably a National Emergency, because if this system is allowed to die, it will take a lot more than a year or even a decade of good rains to restore it .
And playing the blame game as Marilyn et al want do helps not one iota. The country does need rain - sure - but it also needs some urgent real action to seize total control of whatever is left of this vital National resource.
What is so wrong with Wong and Rudd just doing something real - anything!!

]]> By: Chris http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15644 Chris Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15644 <br />Will you all get your heads out of the blame game and look for solutions. It starts by asking why state and federal Labor,National and Liberal MPs didn't query Leith's clear conflicts of interest and overturning them. <br />http://www.nrsm.uq.edu.au/staff/Cvs/leith.boully.pdf Will you all get your heads out of the blame game and look for solutions. It starts by asking why state and federal Labor,National and Liberal MPs didn’t query Leith’s clear conflicts of interest and overturning them.
http://www.nrsm.uq.edu.au/staff/Cvs/leith.boully.pdf

]]> By: JamesK http://www.crikey.com.au/2008/08/21/how-cubbie-and-labor-consumed-the-murray-darling/#comment-15645 JamesK Thu, 01 Jan 1970 10:00:00 +0000 #comment-15645 Yeah ....please please please forgive me Marilyn.<br /><br />It took Jack to demonstrate the blindingly obvious (this is soooo embarassing.....I really am at a loss as to how I failed to see it before now........still it's never too late as my dear sweet aunty Betty used to say) and I am sorry for doubting Labor......... it was that dreadful Mr Downer all along! <br /><br />Still that nice Mr. Rudd and the gentlemanly Mr. Brumby along with the sweet Anna Bligh and Messrs. Iemma and Rann will sit down, enjoy an nice cup of tea and quietly resolve this minor misunderstanding of the Murray-Darling just before Mr. Rudd suits up to save the planet from those dreadful climate change denier troublemakers..... Yeah ….please please please forgive me Marilyn.

It took Jack to demonstrate the blindingly obvious (this is soooo embarassing…..I really am at a loss as to how I failed to see it before now……..still it’s never too late as my dear sweet aunty Betty used to say) and I am sorry for doubting Labor……… it was that dreadful Mr Downer all along!

Still that nice Mr. Rudd and the gentlemanly Mr. Brumby along with the sweet Anna Bligh and Messrs. Iemma and Rann will sit down, enjoy an nice cup of tea and quietly resolve this minor misunderstanding of the Murray-Darling just before Mr. Rudd suits up to save the planet from those dreadful climate change denier troublemakers…..

]]>